From seravilo at netzero.net Sun Jan 1 19:36:17 2006 From: seravilo at netzero.net (DOlivares) Date: Sun, 1 Jan 2006 19:36:17 -0600 Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Message-ID: <003101c60f3c$ef0a6c90$14f46942@coresys1> Who watches The Watcher? Who advises The Guru? Who assists The Good Samaritan? I think we're about to find out pretty soon-- at least until I can get my Lapdog running again (and one of the diagnostic programs to troubleshoot my li'l pony): Meanwhile, I NEED HELP! With my laptop in pieces all over the bench, I can't run DIACOM or DATALINK to give me clues about the usual suspects: Clean-livin' doesn't always pay off if my holidaze so far are any indication. I spent Christmas Eve on a carlift taking apart my right-front axle-- again!-- after being assured by our local "Gear-Guru" (who fully rebuilt that differential less than 6 months before I started hearing that same CLUNKING on left turns again) that all I needed was a new cir-clip (GM #14041989) to keep the axle from popping-out of the side-gear in the differential. HAH! More bad advice and I ended up taking a cab home.... More about that Horror Show in a later mailing. Meanwhile, we got our first technical freeze down here in what was becoming tropical San Antone on Nov. 17th and our first hard-freeze, appropriately, on Dec. 7th, and somewhere in between those times ol' Syclone #773 began throwing fits during start-up and for the first 5 or 6 minutes until the water jacket hits and stays at 180? or so. I'm stumped for the first time in a decade or more! Here's what happens: Since the new Walbro fuel-pump went in a few months ago, cranking times are way down... engine catches pretty quick, but now it won't stay lit and "choke" with the new IAC, which went in along with a new TPS and remote-adjustable FPR about a month before the new Walbro. Now, I have to feather the pedal once the ignition gets going and hold the throttle open a bit while the IAC hunts for about a dozen cycles making the tach swing about 1200 rpm back and forth until we hit the "sweet spot" and the engine takes off smoothly and the IAC-hunting stops, at least for a while. Now, it's safe to put her in gear and drive away as long as I keep a little positive bias in the pedal for the next few minutes every time I have to slow down to an idle or coast speed. THIS PROBLEM IS WICKEDLY WORSE ON COLD DAYS, where ambient air is in the 40s or below, which thankfully is rare. (Ain't this global-warming great!) However, on a couple of occasions when I did have to drive in the 30s-- and even after reaching full-warm-up temperature-- the engine starts cutting out seriously as the SES light comes on! Now, we're talking some MAJOR pumping of the pedal to keep things lit and if I can get on a clear piece of road and cruise a spell at 35 mph or better the problem goes away completely, until I shutdown and the engine gets cold again. I barely even recognize that SES light... hardly ever see it. Driving on warmer days never sees a recurrence of that mid-period cutting-out, and idle is smooth as is the rest of drivability. Warm start-ups see a few moments of that IAC-hunting, but the rpm-sweeps are only on the order of 500rpm and the whole anomaly goes away in about 30 seconds. I've NEVER encountered anything like this in my many years of wrenching! Now, it's time for some wretching!! All that ever gets logged in the way of a trouble-code is 44... not too helpful! Naturally, I replaced the O2 sensor-- no improvement at all! Everything described above instinctually told me this was a weird thermal transient in the injector-drive circuits or else the MAT, CTS or MAP I replaced (for the hell of it) 3 years ago needed to be switched again. So I did... one at a time to see if I could fault-locate the culprit that way. No dice! I'm running out of hardware to replace! I've even tried setting that 10-to-1 Chip to different settings, but the same nasty behavior persists-- the engine's as well as my own! WHO CAN TELL ME WHAT MY PROBLEM(S) IS? Be nice, now.... Dennis O. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060101/9b6719bd/attachment.html From tyfoon at concentric.net Mon Jan 2 07:10:28 2006 From: tyfoon at concentric.net (Frank) Date: Mon, 02 Jan 2006 08:10:28 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Message-ID: <200601021310.IAA08120@alexander.cnc.net> May be the chip itself. I had similar problems with a 10:1 chip many years ago. Frank Plutt Cleveland, OH '91 sy 1404 '92 ty 1737 > DOlivares wrote: > Who watches The Watcher? > > Who advises The Guru? > > Who assists The Good Samaritan? > > I think we're about to find out pretty soon-- at least > until I can get my Lapdog running again (and one of > : > > Meanwhile, I NEED HELP! With my laptop in pieces > all over the bench, I can't run DIACOM or DATALINK > to give me clues about the usual suspects: > > Clean-livin' doesn't always pay off if my holidaze > so far are any indication. I spent Christmas Eve > on a carlift taking apart my right-front axle-- again!-- > after being assured by our local "Gear-Guru" (who > fully rebuilt that differential less than 6 months > before I started hearing that same CLUNKING on left > turns again) that all I needed was a new cir-clip > (GM #14041989) to keep the axle from popping-out of > the side-gear in the differential. HAH! More bad > advice and I ended up taking a cab home.... More > about that Horror Show in a later mailing. > > Meanwhile, we got our first technical freeze down > here in what was becoming tropical San Antone on Nov. 17th and our first hard-freeze, > appropriately, on Dec. 7th, and somewhere in between > those times ol' Syclone #773 began throwing fits during start-up and for the first 5 > or 6 minutes until the water jacket hits and stays > at 180? or so. I'm stumped for the first time in a decade > or more! Here's what happens: > > Since the new Walbro fuel-pump went in a few months ago, cranking > times are way down... engine catches pretty quick, > but now it won't stay lit and "choke" with the new IAC, which went in along with a new TPS and remote-adjustable FPR about a month before > the new Walbro. Now, I have to feather the pedal > once the ignition gets going and hold the throttle > open a bit while the IAC hunts for about a dozen cycles > making the tach swing about 1200 rpm back and forth > until we hit the "sweet spot" and the engine takes > off smoothly and the IAC-hunting stops, at least for > a while. Now, it's safe to put her in gear and drive > away as long as I keep a little positive bias in the > pedal for the next few minutes every time I have to > slow down to an idle or coast speed. > > THIS PROBLEM IS WICKEDLY WORSE ON COLD DAYS, where > ambient air is in the 40s or below, which thankfully > is rare. (Ain't this global-warming great!) However, > on a couple of occasions when I did have to drive > in the 30s-- and even after reaching full-warm-up temperature-- the engine starts > cutting out seriously as the SES light comes on! > Now, we're talking some MAJOR pumping of the pedal > to keep things lit and if I can get on a clear piece > of road and cruise a spell at 35 mph or better the > problem goes away completely, until I shutdown and the engine gets cold again. > I barely even recognize that SES light... hardly ever > see it. Driving on warmer days never sees a recurrence > of that mid-period cutting-out, and idle is smooth > as is the rest of drivability. Warm start-ups see > a few moments of that IAC-hunting, but the rpm-sweeps > are only on the order of 500rpm and the whole anomaly > goes away in about 30 seconds. I've NEVER encountered > anything like this in my many years of wrenching! > Now, it's time for some wretching!! All that ever > gets logged in the way of a trouble-code is 44... not too helpful! > > Naturally, I replaced the O2 sensor-- no improvement > at all! Everything described above instinctually > told me this was a weird thermal transient in the > injector-drive circuits or else the MAT, CTS or MAP > I replaced (for the hell of it) 3 years ago needed > to be switched again. So I did... one at a time to see if I could fault-locate the > culprit that way. No dice! I'm running out of hardware > to replace! I've even tried setting that 10-to-1 > Chip to different settings, but the same nasty behavior > persists-- the engine's as well as my own! > > WHO CAN TELL ME WHAT MY PROBLEM(S) IS? Be nice, now.... > > Dennis O. > From leroy at sunflower.com Mon Jan 2 08:11:51 2006 From: leroy at sunflower.com (Jim Sloan) Date: Mon, 2 Jan 2006 08:11:51 -0600 Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! In-Reply-To: <003101c60f3c$ef0a6c90$14f46942@coresys1> Message-ID: <003c01c60fa6$7d8788e0$6401a8c0@james0uw35t2hd> Happy New Year Dennis! I've had hardware problems with several of the 10-1 adapters. You could swap back to the stock memcal (and map sensor) to rule that out, if your build isn't too radical. I usually keep at least one spare ecm for a substitution test, and have seen quite a few fail in weird ways. Let me know if you need one. Sometimes it helps to go back to the basics, and follow the diagnostics in the service manual http://syty.org/old/d &e-code44.html . Just a few ideas, if you haven't already tried them. Jim _____ From: syty-bounces at syty.org [mailto:syty-bounces at syty.org] On Behalf Of DOlivares Sent: Sunday, January 01, 2006 7:36 PM To: syty at syty.org Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Importance: High Who watches The Watcher? Who advises The Guru? Who assists The Good Samaritan? I think we're about to find out pretty soon-- at least until I can get my Lapdog running again (and one of the diagnostic programs to troubleshoot my li'l pony): Meanwhile, I NEED HELP! With my laptop in pieces all over the bench, I can't run DIACOM or DATALINK to give me clues about the usual suspects: Clean-livin' doesn't always pay off if my holidaze so far are any indication. I spent Christmas Eve on a carlift taking apart my right-front axle-- again!-- after being assured by our local "Gear-Guru" (who fully rebuilt that differential less than 6 months before I started hearing that same CLUNKING on left turns again) that all I needed was a new cir-clip (GM #14041989) to keep the axle from popping-out of the side-gear in the differential. HAH! More bad advice and I ended up taking a cab home.... More about that Horror Show in a later mailing. Meanwhile, we got our first technical freeze down here in what was becoming tropical San Antone on Nov. 17th and our first hard-freeze, appropriately, on Dec. 7th, and somewhere in between those times ol' Syclone #773 began throwing fits during start-up and for the first 5 or 6 minutes until the water jacket hits and stays at 180? or so. I'm stumped for the first time in a decade or more! Here's what happens: Since the new Walbro fuel-pump went in a few months ago, cranking times are way down... engine catches pretty quick, but now it won't stay lit and "choke" with the new IAC, which went in along with a new TPS and remote-adjustable FPR about a month before the new Walbro. Now, I have to feather the pedal once the ignition gets going and hold the throttle open a bit while the IAC hunts for about a dozen cycles making the tach swing about 1200 rpm back and forth until we hit the "sweet spot" and the engine takes off smoothly and the IAC-hunting stops, at least for a while. Now, it's safe to put her in gear and drive away as long as I keep a little positive bias in the pedal for the next few minutes every time I have to slow down to an idle or coast speed. THIS PROBLEM IS WICKEDLY WORSE ON COLD DAYS, where ambient air is in the 40s or below, which thankfully is rare. (Ain't this global-warming great!) However, on a couple of occasions when I did have to drive in the 30s-- and even after reaching full-warm-up temperature-- the engine starts cutting out seriously as the SES light comes on! Now, we're talking some MAJOR pumping of the pedal to keep things lit and if I can get on a clear piece of road and cruise a spell at 35 mph or better the problem goes away completely, until I shutdown and the engine gets cold again. I barely even recognize that SES light... hardly ever see it. Driving on warmer days never sees a recurrence of that mid-period cutting-out, and idle is smooth as is the rest of drivability. Warm start-ups see a few moments of that IAC-hunting, but the rpm-sweeps are only on the order of 500rpm and the whole anomaly goes away in about 30 seconds. I've NEVER encountered anything like this in my many years of wrenching! Now, it's time for some wretching!! All that ever gets logged in the way of a trouble-code is 44... not too helpful! Naturally, I replaced the O2 sensor-- no improvement at all! Everything described above instinctually told me this was a weird thermal transient in the injector-drive circuits or else the MAT, CTS or MAP I replaced (for the hell of it) 3 years ago needed to be switched again. So I did... one at a time to see if I could fault-locate the culprit that way. No dice! I'm running out of hardware to replace! I've even tried setting that 10-to-1 Chip to different settings, but the same nasty behavior persists-- the engine's as well as my own! WHO CAN TELL ME WHAT MY PROBLEM(S) IS? Be nice, now.... Dennis O. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060102/4def9ce3/attachment.html From seravilo at netzero.net Mon Jan 2 12:06:09 2006 From: seravilo at netzero.net (DOlivares) Date: Mon, 2 Jan 2006 12:06:09 -0600 Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! References: <003c01c60fa6$7d8788e0$6401a8c0@james0uw35t2hd> Message-ID: <000d01c60fc7$36f62f50$10f46942@coresys1> Thanks... so far, and happy New Year... et pax hominibus boni voluntatis! [You know who you are.] Unfortunately, I have tried all those diagnostic trees-- even a couple of bushes for good measure! This episode has been going on for nearly a month. As I said, I'm running out of hardware to swap-out. The only things I haven't diddled with is the EST Module in the Distributor and of course the ECM/chip. The reason I haven't fooled with those things is that the misbehavior complained of is SO PREDICTABLE and only afflicts COLD-START-UP conditions, except when it's really cold outside in which case I will get precisely ONE chug-a-lug spasm about 5 minutes into the run-up to full operating temperature... just after everything had been going just fine. That's the worst of it... as far as I can tell without a scantool... seat-of-the-pants power and smoothness is better than ever, otherwise. This is no "intermittent." This is pure predictability! And my experience with bad chips and modules is that they either fail outright or exhibit sporadic, random upsets... before failing outright. That's not what's occurring. Even so, I might drop in my spare EST (Holley Annihilator) just for laughs.... Keep thinking... what else could it be??? What's the connection to cold/cool ambient temperature? D.O. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Jim Sloan To: 'DOlivares' ; syty at syty.org Sent: Monday, January 02, 2006 8:11 AM Subject: RE: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Happy New Year Dennis! I've had hardware problems with several of the 10-1 adapters. You could swap back to the stock memcal (and map sensor) to rule that out, if your build isn't too radical. I usually keep at least one spare ecm for a substitution test, and have seen quite a few fail in weird ways. Let me know if you need one. Sometimes it helps to go back to the basics, and follow the diagnostics in the service manual http://syty.org/old/d&e-code44.html . Just a few ideas, if you haven't already tried them. Jim ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ From: syty-bounces at syty.org [mailto:syty-bounces at syty.org] On Behalf Of DOlivares Sent: Sunday, January 01, 2006 7:36 PM To: syty at syty.org Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Importance: High Who watches The Watcher? Who advises The Guru? Who assists The Good Samaritan? I think we're about to find out pretty soon-- at least until I can get my Lapdog running again (and one of the diagnostic programs to troubleshoot my li'l pony): Meanwhile, I NEED HELP! With my laptop in pieces all over the bench, I can't run DIACOM or DATALINK to give me clues about the usual suspects: Clean-livin' doesn't always pay off if my holidaze so far are any indication. I spent Christmas Eve on a carlift taking apart my right-front axle-- again!-- after being assured by our local "Gear-Guru" (who fully rebuilt that differential less than 6 months before I started hearing that same CLUNKING on left turns again) that all I needed was a new cir-clip (GM #14041989) to keep the axle from popping-out of the side-gear in the differential. HAH! More bad advice and I ended up taking a cab home.... More about that Horror Show in a later mailing. Meanwhile, we got our first technical freeze down here in what was becoming tropical San Antone on Nov. 17th and our first hard-freeze, appropriately, on Dec. 7th, and somewhere in between those times ol' Syclone #773 began throwing fits during start-up and for the first 5 or 6 minutes until the water jacket hits and stays at 180? or so. I'm stumped for the first time in a decade or more! Here's what happens: Since the new Walbro fuel-pump went in a few months ago, cranking times are way down... engine catches pretty quick, but now it won't stay lit and "choke" with the new IAC, which went in along with a new TPS and remote-adjustable FPR about a month before the new Walbro. Now, I have to feather the pedal once the ignition gets going and hold the throttle open a bit while the IAC hunts for about a dozen cycles making the tach swing about 1200 rpm back and forth until we hit the "sweet spot" and the engine takes off smoothly and the IAC-hunting stops, at least for a while. Now, it's safe to put her in gear and drive away as long as I keep a little positive bias in the pedal for the next few minutes every time I have to slow down to an idle or coast speed. THIS PROBLEM IS WICKEDLY WORSE ON COLD DAYS, where ambient air is in the 40s or below, which thankfully is rare. (Ain't this global-warming great!) However, on a couple of occasions when I did have to drive in the 30s-- and even after reaching full-warm-up temperature-- the engine starts cutting out seriously as the SES light comes on! Now, we're talking some MAJOR pumping of the pedal to keep things lit and if I can get on a clear piece of road and cruise a spell at 35 mph or better the problem goes away completely, until I shutdown and the engine gets cold again. I barely even recognize that SES light... hardly ever see it. Driving on warmer days never sees a recurrence of that mid-period cutting-out, and idle is smooth as is the rest of drivability. Warm start-ups see a few moments of that IAC-hunting, but the rpm-sweeps are only on the order of 500rpm and the whole anomaly goes away in about 30 seconds. I've NEVER encountered anything like this in my many years of wrenching! Now, it's time for some wretching!! All that ever gets logged in the way of a trouble-code is 44... not too helpful! Naturally, I replaced the O2 sensor-- no improvement at all! Everything described above instinctually told me this was a weird thermal transient in the injector-drive circuits or else the MAT, CTS or MAP I replaced (for the hell of it) 3 years ago needed to be switched again. So I did... one at a time to see if I could fault-locate the culprit that way. No dice! I'm running out of hardware to replace! I've even tried setting that 10-to-1 Chip to different settings, but the same nasty behavior persists-- the engine's as well as my own! WHO CAN TELL ME WHAT MY PROBLEM(S) IS? Be nice, now.... Dennis O. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060102/cd5ae2b4/attachment.html From Bullyhart at aol.com Mon Jan 2 22:17:42 2006 From: Bullyhart at aol.com (Bullyhart at aol.com) Date: Mon, 2 Jan 2006 23:17:42 EST Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Message-ID: <9d.6eb7753f.30eb54e6@aol.com> ECMs are susceptible to cold/heat just as much as the next electronic sensor. You have diddled with just about every other electronic part, I wouldn't be so quick to rule the ECM/chip out... They are easy to swap... Daron In a message dated 1/2/2006 12:07:38 P.M. Central Standard Time, seravilo at netzero.net writes: Keep thinking... what else could it be??? What's the connection to cold/cool ambient temperature? D.O. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060102/807814ce/attachment.html From technowizard at prodigy.net Tue Jan 3 02:26:39 2006 From: technowizard at prodigy.net (Peter) Date: Tue, 3 Jan 2006 00:26:39 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Syty] What is TV valve lifter rod? Message-ID: <20060103082639.35384.qmail@web80510.mail.yahoo.com> Gentlemen, While working on the throttle body last night, I disconnected the TV cable. When I reconnected and took a test drive, the shift points are delayed and extremely hard. Section 7A1-58 of the service manual says something about the "TV valve lifter rod" dropping down to allow the TV exhaust ball to seat if the cable is broken, disconnected, or extremely out of adjustment. I think this is what happened. It then says if the transmission pan is removed, it should be possible to pull down on the TV exhaust valve lifter rod and let the springs return the rod to its normal up position. No pictures or other mention of the TV valve anywhere that I can find. Has this happened to anyone else? If so, any tips on correcting it? Thanks, Peter Albrecht -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060103/2e6f633b/attachment.html From tyfoon at concentric.net Tue Jan 3 08:39:24 2006 From: tyfoon at concentric.net (Frank) Date: Tue, 03 Jan 2006 09:39:24 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! In-Reply-To: <9d.6eb7753f.30eb54e6@aol.com> Message-ID: <200601031439.JAA09003@theseus.cnc.net> I will agree with Daron on this. Back in the old days when I had one of the original 10-1 chips by Todd A. this is exactly what happened. Cold winter day and engine stumbled and cut out a number of times. Put back original chip (which I always leave in the truck)and all was OK. By the way how old is your 10-1 chip? Is it the pin wheel type? Have not seen one for a long time. Frank Cleveland, OH. > wrote: > > ECMs are susceptible to cold/heat just as much as > the next electronic sensor. You have diddled with just > about every other electronic part, I wouldn't be so > quick to rule the ECM/chip out... They are easy to > swap... > Daron > > In a message dated 1/2/2006 12:07:38 P.M. Central > Standard Time, seravilo at netzero.net writes: > Keep thinking... what else could it be??? What's the connection to cold/cool > ambient temperature? > > D.O. > From tyfoon at concentric.net Tue Jan 3 08:50:57 2006 From: tyfoon at concentric.net (Frank) Date: Tue, 03 Jan 2006 09:50:57 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Syty] What is TV valve lifter rod? In-Reply-To: <20060103082639.35384.qmail@web80510.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <200601031450.JAA15433@theseus.cnc.net> Peter: Sorry, never heard of the TV lifter rod or TV exhaust ball. Taken TV cable off many times and all that had to be done was adjust it when I reinstalled it. Frank > Peter wrote: > Gentlemen, > > While working on the throttle body last night, I disconnected > the TV cable. When I reconnected and took a test > drive, the shift points are delayed and extremely > hard. > > Section 7A1-58 of the service manual says something > about the "TV valve lifter rod" dropping down to allow > the TV exhaust ball to seat if the cable is broken, > disconnected, or extremely out of adjustment. I think > this is what happened. > > It then says if the transmission pan is removed, it > should be possible to pull down on the TV exhaust > valve lifter rod and let the springs return the rod > to its normal up position. > > No pictures or other mention of the TV valve anywhere > that I can find. > > Has this happened to anyone else? If so, any tips > on correcting it? > > Thanks, > > Peter Albrecht From leroy at sunflower.com Tue Jan 3 08:59:02 2006 From: leroy at sunflower.com (Jim Sloan) Date: Tue, 3 Jan 2006 08:59:02 -0600 Subject: [Syty] What is TV valve lifter rod? In-Reply-To: <20060103082639.35384.qmail@web80510.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000001c61076$3f552d90$6401a8c0@james0uw35t2hd> Hi Peter, The TV cable goes into the transmission on the passenger side by the dipstick. If I remember right, there is a small bolt that holds it in place. You could remove the bolt, and pull the cable out of the transmission a couple of inches to make sure it is still attached. I believe it is attached to the "tv valve lifter rod". You can also have someone move the throttle to make sure the cable is intact, while you are watching the rod. The exhaust may be in the way on some trucks. Before you do any of that, re-adjust the tv cable according to the manual, if you haven't already done so. Jim _____ From: syty-bounces at syty.org [mailto:syty-bounces at syty.org] On Behalf Of Peter Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2006 2:27 AM To: syty Subject: [Syty] What is TV valve lifter rod? Gentlemen, While working on the throttle body last night, I disconnected the TV cable. When I reconnected and took a test drive, the shift points are delayed and extremely hard. Section 7A1-58 of the service manual says something about the "TV valve lifter rod" dropping down to allow the TV exhaust ball to seat if the cable is broken, disconnected, or extremely out of adjustment. I think this is what happened. It then says if the transmission pan is removed, it should be possible to pull down on the TV exhaust valve lifter rod and let the springs return the rod to its normal up position. No pictures or other mention of the TV valve anywhere that I can find. Has this happened to anyone else? If so, any tips on correcting it? Thanks, Peter Albrecht -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060103/ee607b22/attachment.html From tydriver at hotmail.com Tue Jan 3 12:49:47 2006 From: tydriver at hotmail.com (Rick In Central Texas) Date: Tue, 03 Jan 2006 12:49:47 -0600 Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! In-Reply-To: <003101c60f3c$ef0a6c90$14f46942@coresys1> Message-ID: One possibility... your coolant temp sensor or wiring is faulty, and your engine *thinks* it's hot when it's not. This would give a lean condition. HTH Rick From: "DOlivares" Reply-To: DOlivares To: Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Date: Sun, 1 Jan 2006 19:36:17 -0600 Who watches The Watcher? Who advises The Guru? Who assists The Good Samaritan? I think we're about to find out pretty soon-- at least until I can get my Lapdog running again (and one of the diagnostic programs to troubleshoot my li'l pony): Meanwhile, I NEED HELP! With my laptop in pieces all over the bench, I can't run DIACOM or DATALINK to give me clues about the usual suspects: Clean-livin' doesn't always pay off if my holidaze so far are any indication. I spent Christmas Eve on a carlift taking apart my right-front axle-- again!-- after being assured by our local "Gear-Guru" (who fully rebuilt that differential less than 6 months before I started hearing that same CLUNKING on left turns again) that all I needed was a new cir-clip (GM #14041989) to keep the axle from popping-out of the side-gear in the differential. HAH! More bad advice and I ended up taking a cab home.... More about that Horror Show in a later mailing. Meanwhile, we got our first technical freeze down here in what was becoming tropical San Antone on Nov. 17th and our first hard-freeze, appropriately, on Dec. 7th, and somewhere in between those times ol' Syclone #773 began throwing fits during start-up and for the first 5 or 6 minutes until the water jacket hits and stays at 180? or so. I'm stumped for the first time in a decade or more! Here's what happens: Since the new Walbro fuel-pump went in a few months ago, cranking times are way down... engine catches pretty quick, but now it won't stay lit and "choke" with the new IAC, which went in along with a new TPS and remote-adjustable FPR about a month before the new Walbro. Now, I have to feather the pedal once the ignition gets going and hold the throttle open a bit while the IAC hunts for about a dozen cycles making the tach swing about 1200 rpm back and forth until we hit the "sweet spot" and the engine takes off smoothly and the IAC-hunting stops, at least for a while. Now, it's safe to put her in gear and drive away as long as I keep a little positive bias in the pedal for the next few minutes every time I have to slow down to an idle or coast speed. THIS PROBLEM IS WICKEDLY WORSE ON COLD DAYS, where ambient air is in the 40s or below, which thankfully is rare. (Ain't this global-warming great!) However, on a couple of occasions when I did have to drive in the 30s-- and even after reaching full-warm-up temperature-- the engine starts cutting out seriously as the SES light comes on! Now, we're talking some MAJOR pumping of the pedal to keep things lit and if I can get on a clear piece of road and cruise a spell at 35 mph or better the problem goes away completely, until I shutdown and the engine gets cold again. I barely even recognize that SES light... hardly ever see it. Driving on warmer days never sees a recurrence of that mid-period cutting-out, and idle is smooth as is the rest of drivability. Warm start-ups see a few moments of that IAC-hunting, but the rpm-sweeps are only on the order of 500rpm and the whole anomaly goes away in about 30 seconds. I've NEVER encountered anything like this in my many years of wrenching! Now, it's time for some wretching!! All that ever gets logged in the way of a trouble-code is 44... not too helpful! Naturally, I replaced the O2 sensor-- no improvement at all! Everything described above instinctually told me this was a weird thermal transient in the injector-drive circuits or else the MAT, CTS or MAP I replaced (for the hell of it) 3 years ago needed to be switched again. So I did... one at a time to see if I could fault-locate the culprit that way. No dice! I'm running out of hardware to replace! I've even tried setting that 10-to-1 Chip to different settings, but the same nasty behavior persists-- the engine's as well as my own! WHO CAN TELL ME WHAT MY PROBLEM(S) IS? Be nice, now.... Dennis O. _______________________________________________ Syty mailing list Syty at syty.org http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty _________________________________________________________________ Don?t just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/ From RROBBO43 at aol.com Tue Jan 3 13:49:08 2006 From: RROBBO43 at aol.com (RROBBO43 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 3 Jan 2006 14:49:08 EST Subject: [Syty] ATR Message-ID: <20.5304e8aa.30ec2f34@aol.com> Does anyone know if Applied Technologies & Research has gone out of business? I was trying to order a couple of items and the phone # was disconnected and no new listing. Please email me back if you know any about this. Thanks in advance, Rob Robinette South Lake Tahoe, Ca. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060103/6d91e854/attachment.html From tydriver at turbols6.com Tue Jan 3 14:05:57 2006 From: tydriver at turbols6.com (Todd) Date: Tue, 3 Jan 2006 15:05:57 -0500 Subject: [Syty] ATR References: <20.5304e8aa.30ec2f34@aol.com> Message-ID: <002a01c610a1$1cc5ec30$6401a8c0@athlon> Yes, they filed bankruptcy some time ago... There was some talk about one of the vendors buying their remaining stock buy nothing has ever been confirmed. Todd ----- Original Message ----- From: RROBBO43 at aol.com To: syty at syty.org Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2006 2:49 PM Subject: [Syty] ATR Does anyone know if Applied Technologies & Research has gone out of business? I was trying to order a couple of items and the phone # was disconnected and no new listing. Please email me back if you know any about this. Thanks in advance, Rob Robinette South Lake Tahoe, Ca. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Syty mailing list Syty at syty.org http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060103/d21d629f/attachment.html -------------- next part -------------- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.371 / Virus Database: 267.14.11/219 - Release Date: 1/2/2006 From seravilo at netzero.net Tue Jan 3 15:24:32 2006 From: seravilo at netzero.net (DOlivares) Date: Tue, 3 Jan 2006 15:24:32 -0600 Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! References: Message-ID: <001a01c610ac$17c19620$16f46942@coresys1> Yea, That's exactly what I was thinking early on in my diagnostic process... which is why they CTS was the very first thing I replaced and checked for 5V at the connector. That or the next-day replacement of the MAT (a.k.a. IAT) should've solved the temp-triggered problem, BUT NO DICE IN EITHER CASE! The other likely cause could be due to my inadvertent replacing one bad sensor(s) with another one right out of the box-- it's possible but unlikely. Moreover, if I had bad wiring or bad sensors the ECM would throw an appropriate sensor/wire-fault code (e.g., 14, 23, 25 or something else) instead of that stupid "44." Unless the Spark Module or ECM 10-in-1 is miraculously acting as its own temp-sensor input (and from that snide remark you might be able to guess what my feelings about that possibility are), I pretty much remain STUMPED. In the past couple of daze (not days!), it's been in the low/middle-80s here in the Alamo City, and when I went to cold-start the 'Clone both times with ambient air above 70 the engine fires right up with none of that hunt-and-swing baloney. Same thing this morning on my way to my first-ever ROOT-CANAL procedure: Air temp was just at 60 and the motor fired right up, idled "high" as in proper choke-mode, and I took off smooth as silk; however, it did go into that balk-and-cut-out routine about a block away from my driveway. It also went away faster than normal and the rest of my merry ride to the oral butcher went without incident. So, if I can just get it to stay above 70 every time I wanna go driving I'm free from worries! I can't believe I'm the only one with this syndrome...! D.O. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Rick In Central Texas To: seravilo at netzero.net ; syty at syty.org Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2006 12:49 PM Subject: RE: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! One possibility... your coolant temp sensor or wiring is faulty, and your engine *thinks* it's hot when it's not. This would give a lean condition. HTH Rick From: "DOlivares" Reply-To: DOlivares To: Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Date: Sun, 1 Jan 2006 19:36:17 -0600 Who watches The Watcher? Who advises The Guru? Who assists The Good Samaritan? I think we're about to find out pretty soon-- at least until I can get my Lapdog running again (and one of the diagnostic programs to troubleshoot my li'l pony): Meanwhile, I NEED HELP! With my laptop in pieces all over the bench, I can't run DIACOM or DATALINK to give me clues about the usual suspects: Clean-livin' doesn't always pay off if my holidaze so far are any indication. I spent Christmas Eve on a carlift taking apart my right-front axle-- again!-- after being assured by our local "Gear-Guru" (who fully rebuilt that differential less than 6 months before I started hearing that same CLUNKING on left turns again) that all I needed was a new cir-clip (GM #14041989) to keep the axle from popping-out of the side-gear in the differential. HAH! More bad advice and I ended up taking a cab home.... More about that Horror Show in a later mailing. Meanwhile, we got our first technical freeze down here in what was becoming tropical San Antone on Nov. 17th and our first hard-freeze, appropriately, on Dec. 7th, and somewhere in between those times ol' Syclone #773 began throwing fits during start-up and for the first 5 or 6 minutes until the water jacket hits and stays at 180? or so. I'm stumped for the first time in a decade or more! Here's what happens: Since the new Walbro fuel-pump went in a few months ago, cranking times are way down... engine catches pretty quick, but now it won't stay lit and "choke" with the new IAC, which went in along with a new TPS and remote-adjustable FPR about a month before the new Walbro. Now, I have to feather the pedal once the ignition gets going and hold the throttle open a bit while the IAC hunts for about a dozen cycles making the tach swing about 1200 rpm back and forth until we hit the "sweet spot" and the engine takes off smoothly and the IAC-hunting stops, at least for a while. Now, it's safe to put her in gear and drive away as long as I keep a little positive bias in the pedal for the next few minutes every time I have to slow down to an idle or coast speed. THIS PROBLEM IS WICKEDLY WORSE ON COLD DAYS, where ambient air is in the 40s or below, which thankfully is rare. (Ain't this global-warming great!) However, on a couple of occasions when I did have to drive in the 30s-- and even after reaching full-warm-up temperature-- the engine starts cutting out seriously as the SES light comes on! Now, we're talking some MAJOR pumping of the pedal to keep things lit and if I can get on a clear piece of road and cruise a spell at 35 mph or better the problem goes away completely, until I shutdown and the engine gets cold again. I barely even recognize that SES light... hardly ever see it. Driving on warmer days never sees a recurrence of that mid-period cutting-out, and idle is smooth as is the rest of drivability. Warm start-ups see a few moments of that IAC-hunting, but the rpm-sweeps are only on the order of 500rpm and the whole anomaly goes away in about 30 seconds. I've NEVER encountered anything like this in my many years of wrenching! Now, it's time for some wretching!! All that ever gets logged in the way of a trouble-code is 44... not too helpful! Naturally, I replaced the O2 sensor-- no improvement at all! Everything described above instinctually told me this was a weird thermal transient in the injector-drive circuits or else the MAT, CTS or MAP I replaced (for the hell of it) 3 years ago needed to be switched again. So I did... one at a time to see if I could fault-locate the culprit that way. No dice! I'm running out of hardware to replace! I've even tried setting that 10-to-1 Chip to different settings, but the same nasty behavior persists-- the engine's as well as my own! WHO CAN TELL ME WHAT MY PROBLEM(S) IS? Be nice, now.... Dennis O. _______________________________________________ Syty mailing list Syty at syty.org http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty _________________________________________________________________ Don't just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060103/26c8f47b/attachment.html From seravilo at netzero.net Tue Jan 3 15:28:01 2006 From: seravilo at netzero.net (DOlivares) Date: Tue, 3 Jan 2006 15:28:01 -0600 Subject: [Syty] ATR References: <20.5304e8aa.30ec2f34@aol.com> Message-ID: <002801c610ac$944fb9b0$16f46942@coresys1> I had exactly the same experience a couple o' weeks ago... website was dead. I figured they either went under or shut-down for the "Holidaze" as many hard-parts manufacturing outfits do... it's simply traditional. If they're not back on the air in a week you can guess the worst.... D.O. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: RROBBO43 at aol.com To: syty at syty.org Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2006 1:49 PM Subject: [Syty] ATR Does anyone know if Applied Technologies & Research has gone out of business? I was trying to order a couple of items and the phone # was disconnected and no new listing. Please email me back if you know any about this. Thanks in advance, Rob Robinette South Lake Tahoe, Ca. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ Syty mailing list Syty at syty.org http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060103/a098fd10/attachment.html From brassmonkey at ec.rr.com Tue Jan 3 15:48:41 2006 From: brassmonkey at ec.rr.com (Mel) Date: Tue, 3 Jan 2006 16:48:41 -0500 Subject: Fw: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Message-ID: <003401c610af$766883c0$47f83842@mgochnour> Your time has run out, put in more quarters. Cruzin' Mel Man Semper Fi Keep your fork ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rick In Central Texas" To: ; Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2006 1:49 PM Subject: RE: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! > One possibility... your coolant temp sensor or wiring is faulty, and your > engine *thinks* it's hot when it's not. This would give a lean condition. > HTH > > Rick > > > From: "DOlivares" > Reply-To: DOlivares > To: > Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! > Date: Sun, 1 Jan 2006 19:36:17 -0600 > > Who watches The Watcher? > > Who advises The Guru? > > Who assists The Good Samaritan? > > I think we're about to find out pretty soon-- at least until I can get my > Lapdog running again (and one of the diagnostic programs to troubleshoot > my li'l pony): > > Meanwhile, I NEED HELP! With my laptop in pieces all over the bench, I > can't run DIACOM or DATALINK to give me clues about the usual suspects: > > Clean-livin' doesn't always pay off if my holidaze so far are any > indication. I spent Christmas Eve on a carlift taking apart my > right-front axle-- again!-- after being assured by our local "Gear-Guru" > (who fully rebuilt that differential less than 6 months before I started > hearing that same CLUNKING on left turns again) that all I needed was a > new cir-clip (GM #14041989) to keep the axle from popping-out of the > side-gear in the differential. HAH! More bad advice and I ended up > taking a cab home.... More about that Horror Show in a later mailing. > > Meanwhile, we got our first technical freeze down here in what was > becoming tropical San Antone on Nov. 17th and our first hard-freeze, > appropriately, on Dec. 7th, and somewhere in between those times ol' > Syclone #773 began throwing fits during start-up and for the first 5 or 6 > minutes until the water jacket hits and stays at 180? or so. I'm stumped > for the first time in a decade or more! Here's what happens: > > Since the new Walbro fuel-pump went in a few months ago, cranking times > are way down... engine catches pretty quick, but now it won't stay lit and > "choke" with the new IAC, which went in along with a new TPS and > remote-adjustable FPR about a month before the new Walbro. Now, I have to > feather the pedal once the ignition gets going and hold the throttle open > a bit while the IAC hunts for about a dozen cycles making the tach swing > about 1200 rpm back and forth until we hit the "sweet spot" and the engine > takes off smoothly and the IAC-hunting stops, at least for a while. Now, > it's safe to put her in gear and drive away as long as I keep a little > positive bias in the pedal for the next few minutes every time I have to > slow down to an idle or coast speed. > > THIS PROBLEM IS WICKEDLY WORSE ON COLD DAYS, where ambient air is in the > 40s or below, which thankfully is rare. (Ain't this global-warming > great!) However, on a couple of occasions when I did have to drive in the > 30s-- and even after reaching full-warm-up temperature-- the engine starts > cutting out seriously as the SES light comes on! Now, we're talking some > MAJOR pumping of the pedal to keep things lit and if I can get on a clear > piece of road and cruise a spell at 35 mph or better the problem goes away > completely, until I shutdown and the engine gets cold again. I barely > even recognize that SES light... hardly ever see it. Driving on warmer > days never sees a recurrence of that mid-period cutting-out, and idle is > smooth as is the rest of drivability. Warm start-ups see a few moments of > that IAC-hunting, but the rpm-sweeps are only on the order of 500rpm and > the whole anomaly goes away in about 30 seconds. I've NEVER encountered > anything like this in my many years of wrenching! Now, it's time for some > wretching!! All that ever gets logged in the way of a trouble-code is > 44... not too helpful! > > Naturally, I replaced the O2 sensor-- no improvement at all! Everything > described above instinctually told me this was a weird thermal transient > in the injector-drive circuits or else the MAT, CTS or MAP I replaced (for > the hell of it) 3 years ago needed to be switched again. So I did... one > at a time to see if I could fault-locate the culprit that way. No dice! > I'm running out of hardware to replace! I've even tried setting that > 10-to-1 Chip to different settings, but the same nasty behavior persists-- > the engine's as well as my own! > > WHO CAN TELL ME WHAT MY PROBLEM(S) IS? Be nice, now.... > > Dennis O. > > > _______________________________________________ > Syty mailing list > Syty at syty.org > http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty > > _________________________________________________________________ > Don?t just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! > http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/ > > _______________________________________________ > Syty mailing list > Syty at syty.org > http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty From tydriver at hotmail.com Tue Jan 3 16:32:04 2006 From: tydriver at hotmail.com (Rick In Central Texas) Date: Tue, 03 Jan 2006 16:32:04 -0600 Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! In-Reply-To: <001a01c610ac$17c19620$16f46942@coresys1> Message-ID: Sorry, I overlooked that you'd already replaced the CTS, and I agree a broken/shorted wire would give a code 14 or 15. Condolences on the root canal. I've had a few.... not fun. I'll keep brainstorming... From: "DOlivares" Reply-To: "DOlivares" To: "Rick In Central Texas" , Subject: Re: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Date: Tue, 3 Jan 2006 15:24:32 -0600 Yea, That's exactly what I was thinking early on in my diagnostic process... which is why they CTS was the very first thing I replaced and checked for 5V at the connector. That or the next-day replacement of the MAT (a.k.a. IAT) should've solved the temp-triggered problem, BUT NO DICE IN EITHER CASE! The other likely cause could be due to my inadvertent replacing one bad sensor(s) with another one right out of the box-- it's possible but unlikely. Moreover, if I had bad wiring or bad sensors the ECM would throw an appropriate sensor/wire-fault code (e.g., 14, 23, 25 or something else) instead of that stupid "44." Unless the Spark Module or ECM 10-in-1 is miraculously acting as its own temp-sensor input (and from that snide remark you might be able to guess what my feelings about that possibility are), I pretty much remain STUMPED. In the past couple of daze (not days!), it's been in the low/middle-80s here in the Alamo City, and when I went to cold-start the 'Clone both times with ambient air above 70 the engine fires right up with none of that hunt-and-swing baloney. Same thing this morning on my way to my first-ever ROOT-CANAL procedure: Air temp was just at 60 and the motor fired right up, idled "high" as in proper choke-mode, and I took off smooth as silk; however, it did go into that balk-and-cut-out routine about a block away from my driveway. It also went away faster than normal and the rest of my merry ride to the oral butcher went without incident. So, if I can just get it to stay above 70 every time I wanna go driving I'm free from worries! I can't believe I'm the only one with this syndrome...! D.O. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Rick In Central Texas To: seravilo at netzero.net ; syty at syty.org Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2006 12:49 PM Subject: RE: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! One possibility... your coolant temp sensor or wiring is faulty, and your engine *thinks* it's hot when it's not. This would give a lean condition. HTH Rick From: "DOlivares" Reply-To: DOlivares To: Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Date: Sun, 1 Jan 2006 19:36:17 -0600 Who watches The Watcher? Who advises The Guru? Who assists The Good Samaritan? I think we're about to find out pretty soon-- at least until I can get my Lapdog running again (and one of the diagnostic programs to troubleshoot my li'l pony): Meanwhile, I NEED HELP! With my laptop in pieces all over the bench, I can't run DIACOM or DATALINK to give me clues about the usual suspects: Clean-livin' doesn't always pay off if my holidaze so far are any indication. I spent Christmas Eve on a carlift taking apart my right-front axle-- again!-- after being assured by our local "Gear-Guru" (who fully rebuilt that differential less than 6 months before I started hearing that same CLUNKING on left turns again) that all I needed was a new cir-clip (GM #14041989) to keep the axle from popping-out of the side-gear in the differential. HAH! More bad advice and I ended up taking a cab home.... More about that Horror Show in a later mailing. Meanwhile, we got our first technical freeze down here in what was becoming tropical San Antone on Nov. 17th and our first hard-freeze, appropriately, on Dec. 7th, and somewhere in between those times ol' Syclone #773 began throwing fits during start-up and for the first 5 or 6 minutes until the water jacket hits and stays at 180? or so. I'm stumped for the first time in a decade or more! Here's what happens: Since the new Walbro fuel-pump went in a few months ago, cranking times are way down... engine catches pretty quick, but now it won't stay lit and "choke" with the new IAC, which went in along with a new TPS and remote-adjustable FPR about a month before the new Walbro. Now, I have to feather the pedal once the ignition gets going and hold the throttle open a bit while the IAC hunts for about a dozen cycles making the tach swing about 1200 rpm back and forth until we hit the "sweet spot" and the engine takes off smoothly and the IAC-hunting stops, at least for a while. Now, it's safe to put her in gear and drive away as long as I keep a little positive bias in the pedal for the next few minutes every time I have to slow down to an idle or coast speed. THIS PROBLEM IS WICKEDLY WORSE ON COLD DAYS, where ambient air is in the 40s or below, which thankfully is rare. (Ain't this global-warming great!) However, on a couple of occasions when I did have to drive in the 30s-- and even after reaching full-warm-up temperature-- the engine starts cutting out seriously as the SES light comes on! Now, we're talking some MAJOR pumping of the pedal to keep things lit and if I can get on a clear piece of road and cruise a spell at 35 mph or better the problem goes away completely, until I shutdown and the engine gets cold again. I barely even recognize that SES light... hardly ever see it. Driving on warmer days never sees a recurrence of that mid-period cutting-out, and idle is smooth as is the rest of drivability. Warm start-ups see a few moments of that IAC-hunting, but the rpm-sweeps are only on the order of 500rpm and the whole anomaly goes away in about 30 seconds. I've NEVER encountered anything like this in my many years of wrenching! Now, it's time for some wretching!! All that ever gets logged in the way of a trouble-code is 44... not too helpful! Naturally, I replaced the O2 sensor-- no improvement at all! Everything described above instinctually told me this was a weird thermal transient in the injector-drive circuits or else the MAT, CTS or MAP I replaced (for the hell of it) 3 years ago needed to be switched again. So I did... one at a time to see if I could fault-locate the culprit that way. No dice! I'm running out of hardware to replace! I've even tried setting that 10-to-1 Chip to different settings, but the same nasty behavior persists-- the engine's as well as my own! WHO CAN TELL ME WHAT MY PROBLEM(S) IS? Be nice, now.... Dennis O. _______________________________________________ Syty mailing list Syty at syty.org http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty _________________________________________________________________ Don't just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/ _________________________________________________________________ FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar ? get it now! http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/ From jabbatruck at gmail.com Tue Jan 3 21:33:41 2006 From: jabbatruck at gmail.com (Jabba Truck) Date: Tue, 3 Jan 2006 21:33:41 -0600 Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! In-Reply-To: <001a01c610ac$17c19620$16f46942@coresys1> References: <001a01c610ac$17c19620$16f46942@coresys1> Message-ID: Try looking for a vacuum leak. The truck could be sucking air from unapproved places, and the 'puter can't correct it. Colder air = more extra O2. On 1/3/06, DOlivares wrote: > > Yea, > > That's exactly what I was thinking early on in my diagnostic > process... which is why they CTS was the very first thing I replaced and > checked for 5V at the connector. That or the next-day replacement of the > MAT (a.k.a. IAT) should've solved the temp-triggered problem, BUT NO DICE > IN EITHER CASE! > > The other likely cause could be due to my inadvertent replacing one > bad sensor(s) with another one right out of the box-- it's possible but > unlikely. Moreover, if I had bad wiring or bad sensors the ECM would throw > an appropriate sensor/wire-fault code (e.g., 14, 23, 25 or *something*else) instead of that stupid "44." Unless the Spark Module or ECM 10-in-1 > is miraculously acting as its own temp-sensor input (and from that snide > remark you might be able to guess what my feelings about *that*possibility are), I pretty much remain STUMPED. > > In the past couple of daze (not days!), it's been in the > low/middle-80s here in the Alamo City, and when I went to cold-start the > 'Clone both times with ambient air above 70 the engine fires right up with > none of that hunt-and-swing baloney. Same thing this morning on my way to > my first-ever ROOT-CANAL procedure: Air temp was just at 60 and the motor > fired right up, idled "high" as in proper choke-mode, and I took off smooth > as silk; however, it did go into that balk-and-cut-out routine about a block > away from my driveway. It also went away faster than normal and the rest of > my merry ride to the oral butcher went without incident. > > So, if I can just get it to stay above 70 every time I wanna go > driving I'm free from worries! I can't believe I'm the only one with this > syndrome...! > > D.O. > ------------------------------ > ----- Original Message ----- *From:* Rick In Central Texas > *To:* seravilo at netzero.net ; syty at syty.org > *Sent:* Tuesday, January 03, 2006 12:49 PM > *Subject:* RE: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! > > One possibility... your coolant temp sensor or wiring is faulty, and your > engine *thinks* it's hot when it's not. This would give a lean > condition. > HTH > > Rick > > > From: "DOlivares" > Reply-To: DOlivares > To: > Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! > Date: Sun, 1 Jan 2006 19:36:17 -0600 > > Who watches The Watcher? > > Who advises The Guru? > > Who assists The Good Samaritan? > > I think we're about to find out pretty soon-- at least until I can get my > Lapdog running again (and one of the diagnostic programs to troubleshoot > my > li'l pony): > > Meanwhile, I NEED HELP! With my laptop in pieces all over the bench, I > can't run DIACOM or DATALINK to give me clues about the usual suspects: > > Clean-livin' doesn't always pay off if my holidaze so far are any > indication. I spent Christmas Eve on a carlift taking apart my > right-front > axle-- again!-- after being assured by our local "Gear-Guru" (who fully > rebuilt that differential less than 6 months before I started hearing that > > same CLUNKING on left turns again) that all I needed was a new cir-clip > (GM > #14041989) to keep the axle from popping-out of the side-gear in the > differential. HAH! More bad advice and I ended up taking a cab home.... > > More about that Horror Show in a later mailing. > > Meanwhile, we got our first technical freeze down here in what was > becoming > tropical San Antone on Nov. 17th and our first hard-freeze, appropriately, > > on Dec. 7th, and somewhere in between those times ol' Syclone #773 began > throwing fits during start-up and for the first 5 or 6 minutes until the > water jacket hits and stays at 180? or so. I'm stumped for the first time > > in a decade or more! Here's what happens: > > Since the new Walbro fuel-pump went in a few months ago, cranking times > are > way down... engine catches pretty quick, but now it won't stay lit and > "choke" with the new IAC, which went in along with a new TPS and > remote-adjustable FPR about a month before the new Walbro. Now, I have to > > feather the pedal once the ignition gets going and hold the throttle open > a > bit while the IAC hunts for about a dozen cycles making the tach swing > about > 1200 rpm back and forth until we hit the "sweet spot" and the engine takes > > off smoothly and the IAC-hunting stops, at least for a while. Now, it's > safe to put her in gear and drive away as long as I keep a little positive > > bias in the pedal for the next few minutes every time I have to slow down > to > an idle or coast speed. > > THIS PROBLEM IS WICKEDLY WORSE ON COLD DAYS, where ambient air is in the > 40s > or below, which thankfully is rare. (Ain't this global-warming great!) > However, on a couple of occasions when I did have to drive in the 30s-- > and > even after reaching full-warm-up temperature-- the engine starts cutting > out > seriously as the SES light comes on! Now, we're talking some MAJOR > pumping > of the pedal to keep things lit and if I can get on a clear piece of road > and cruise a spell at 35 mph or better the problem goes away completely, > until I shutdown and the engine gets cold again. I barely even recognize > that SES light... hardly ever see it. Driving on warmer days never sees a > > recurrence of that mid-period cutting-out, and idle is smooth as is the > rest > of drivability. Warm start-ups see a few moments of that IAC-hunting, but > > the rpm-sweeps are only on the order of 500rpm and the whole anomaly goes > away in about 30 seconds. I've NEVER encountered anything like this in my > > many years of wrenching! Now, it's time for some wretching!! All that > ever > gets logged in the way of a trouble-code is 44... not too helpful! > > Naturally, I replaced the O2 sensor-- no improvement at all! Everything > described above instinctually told me this was a weird thermal transient > in > the injector-drive circuits or else the MAT, CTS or MAP I replaced (for > the > hell of it) 3 years ago needed to be switched again. So I did... one at a > > time to see if I could fault-locate the culprit that way. No dice! I'm > running out of hardware to replace! I've even tried setting that 10-to-1 > Chip to different settings, but the same nasty behavior persists-- the > engine's as well as my own! > > WHO CAN TELL ME WHAT MY PROBLEM(S) IS? Be nice, now.... > > Dennis O. > > > _______________________________________________ > Syty mailing list > Syty at syty.org > http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty > > _________________________________________________________________ > Don't just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! > http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/ > > > _______________________________________________ > Syty mailing list > Syty at syty.org > http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060103/d89b9a03/attachment.html From seravilo at netzero.net Tue Jan 3 23:21:18 2006 From: seravilo at netzero.net (DOlivares) Date: Tue, 3 Jan 2006 23:21:18 -0600 Subject: [Syty] ATR References: <19f.434786cd.30ec4d95@aol.com> Message-ID: <000901c610ee$b36a8040$12f46942@coresys1> THIS could be a great opportunity for another MASS-BUY! Dibs on a set of headers! Also, another "7th Injector" would be nice.... Head Vulture -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: RROBBO43 at aol.com To: seravilo at netzero.net Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2006 3:58 PM Subject: Re: [Syty] ATR Marty said that they went out of business and he thought someone was trying to buy the inventory. Rob -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060103/cf282e1e/attachment.html From seravilo at netzero.net Tue Jan 3 23:24:46 2006 From: seravilo at netzero.net (DOlivares) Date: Tue, 3 Jan 2006 23:24:46 -0600 Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! References: <001a01c610ac$17c19620$16f46942@coresys1> Message-ID: <001c01c610ef$2e0d75a0$12f46942@coresys1> Vacuum leaks was the SECOND thing I tested for. Nope, tight as a drum... and a vacuum leak would KEEP giving trouble, not just at warm-up. Nice try anyway... keep thinkin', D.O. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Jabba Truck To: DOlivares Cc: Rick In Central Texas ; syty at syty.org Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2006 9:33 PM Subject: Re: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Try looking for a vacuum leak. The truck could be sucking air from unapproved places, and the 'puter can't correct it. Colder air = more extra O2. On 1/3/06, DOlivares wrote: Yea, That's exactly what I was thinking early on in my diagnostic process... which is why they CTS was the very first thing I replaced and checked for 5V at the connector. That or the next-day replacement of the MAT (a.k.a. IAT) should've solved the temp-triggered problem, BUT NO DICE IN EITHER CASE! The other likely cause could be due to my inadvertent replacing one bad sensor(s) with another one right out of the box-- it's possible but unlikely. Moreover, if I had bad wiring or bad sensors the ECM would throw an appropriate sensor/wire-fault code (e.g., 14, 23, 25 or something else) instead of that stupid "44." Unless the Spark Module or ECM 10-in-1 is miraculously acting as its own temp-sensor input (and from that snide remark you might be able to guess what my feelings about that possibility are), I pretty much remain STUMPED. In the past couple of daze (not days!), it's been in the low/middle-80s here in the Alamo City, and when I went to cold-start the 'Clone both times with ambient air above 70 the engine fires right up with none of that hunt-and-swing baloney. Same thing this morning on my way to my first-ever ROOT-CANAL procedure: Air temp was just at 60 and the motor fired right up, idled "high" as in proper choke-mode, and I took off smooth as silk; however, it did go into that balk-and-cut-out routine about a block away from my driveway. It also went away faster than normal and the rest of my merry ride to the oral butcher went without incident. So, if I can just get it to stay above 70 every time I wanna go driving I'm free from worries! I can't believe I'm the only one with this syndrome...! D.O. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ----- Original Message ----- From: Rick In Central Texas To: seravilo at netzero.net ; syty at syty.org Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2006 12:49 PM Subject: RE: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! One possibility... your coolant temp sensor or wiring is faulty, and your engine *thinks* it's hot when it's not. This would give a lean condition. HTH Rick From: "DOlivares" Reply-To: DOlivares To: < syty at syty.org> Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Date: Sun, 1 Jan 2006 19:36:17 -0600 Who watches The Watcher? Who advises The Guru? Who assists The Good Samaritan? I think we're about to find out pretty soon-- at least until I can get my Lapdog running again (and one of the diagnostic programs to troubleshoot my li'l pony): Meanwhile, I NEED HELP! With my laptop in pieces all over the bench, I can't run DIACOM or DATALINK to give me clues about the usual suspects: Clean-livin' doesn't always pay off if my holidaze so far are any indication. I spent Christmas Eve on a carlift taking apart my right-front axle-- again!-- after being assured by our local "Gear-Guru" (who fully rebuilt that differential less than 6 months before I started hearing that same CLUNKING on left turns again) that all I needed was a new cir-clip (GM #14041989) to keep the axle from popping-out of the side-gear in the differential. HAH! More bad advice and I ended up taking a cab home.... More about that Horror Show in a later mailing. Meanwhile, we got our first technical freeze down here in what was becoming tropical San Antone on Nov. 17th and our first hard-freeze, appropriately, on Dec. 7th, and somewhere in between those times ol' Syclone #773 began throwing fits during start-up and for the first 5 or 6 minutes until the water jacket hits and stays at 180? or so. I'm stumped for the first time in a decade or more! Here's what happens: Since the new Walbro fuel-pump went in a few months ago, cranking times are way down... engine catches pretty quick, but now it won't stay lit and "choke" with the new IAC, which went in along with a new TPS and remote-adjustable FPR about a month before the new Walbro. Now, I have to feather the pedal once the ignition gets going and hold the throttle open a bit while the IAC hunts for about a dozen cycles making the tach swing about 1200 rpm back and forth until we hit the "sweet spot" and the engine takes off smoothly and the IAC-hunting stops, at least for a while. Now, it's safe to put her in gear and drive away as long as I keep a little positive bias in the pedal for the next few minutes every time I have to slow down to an idle or coast speed. THIS PROBLEM IS WICKEDLY WORSE ON COLD DAYS, where ambient air is in the 40s or below, which thankfully is rare. (Ain't this global-warming great!) However, on a couple of occasions when I did have to drive in the 30s-- and even after reaching full-warm-up temperature-- the engine starts cutting out seriously as the SES light comes on! Now, we're talking some MAJOR pumping of the pedal to keep things lit and if I can get on a clear piece of road and cruise a spell at 35 mph or better the problem goes away completely, until I shutdown and the engine gets cold again. I barely even recognize that SES light... hardly ever see it. Driving on warmer days never sees a recurrence of that mid-period cutting-out, and idle is smooth as is the rest of drivability. Warm start-ups see a few moments of that IAC-hunting, but the rpm-sweeps are only on the order of 500rpm and the whole anomaly goes away in about 30 seconds. I've NEVER encountered anything like this in my many years of wrenching! Now, it's time for some wretching!! All that ever gets logged in the way of a trouble-code is 44... not too helpful! Naturally, I replaced the O2 sensor-- no improvement at all! Everything described above instinctually told me this was a weird thermal transient in the injector-drive circuits or else the MAT, CTS or MAP I replaced (for the hell of it) 3 years ago needed to be switched again. So I did... one at a time to see if I could fault-locate the culprit that way. No dice! I'm running out of hardware to replace! I've even tried setting that 10-to-1 Chip to different settings, but the same nasty behavior persists-- the engine's as well as my own! WHO CAN TELL ME WHAT MY PROBLEM(S) IS? Be nice, now.... Dennis O. _______________________________________________ Syty mailing list Syty at syty.org http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty _________________________________________________________________ Don't just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/ _______________________________________________ Syty mailing list Syty at syty.org http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060103/0556fcc0/attachment.html From L1D2B at aol.com Tue Jan 3 23:49:28 2006 From: L1D2B at aol.com (L1D2B at aol.com) Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2006 00:49:28 EST Subject: [Syty] What is TV valve lifter rod? Message-ID: <1e9.4a0eb444.30ecbbe8@aol.com> Yes, having done ~ ? Doz Trans's, I remember that area well. The TV cable wire is bent 90 Deg at the end and that hooks into a hole in the top end of the "lifter rod". It can be a real bear to get connected and keep connected because it wants to keep slipping off. Then when adjusting the cable, make sure U get it tight enuf, or else U risk a slipping trans and the potential for burning out bands Lynn D. Brown Lakewood, CO 80232 and Placentia, CA 92870 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060104/a9f24f29/attachment.html From hank173 at msn.com Wed Jan 4 02:15:33 2006 From: hank173 at msn.com (Rick CHASTAIN) Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2006 00:15:33 -0800 Subject: [Syty] Fastest stock turbo SYclone References: <19f.434786cd.30ec4d95@aol.com> <000901c610ee$b36a8040$12f46942@coresys1> Message-ID: Hey all, Just would like to hear about all the mods TookyCat had done to his SY to run 12.26 Was his engine 100% stock? etc? Thanks The Hankster. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060104/6b97d331/attachment.html From lowell at raisongroup.com Wed Jan 4 08:39:25 2006 From: lowell at raisongroup.com (Lowell Raison) Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2006 09:39:25 -0500 Subject: [Syty] 93 Ty Message-ID: <002601c6113c$a8f164a0$0310000a@hewlettmi4yof2> Looking for a very clean, low mileage 93 Ty to go with our 92 Teal Ty. Does anyone know of any for sale? Lowell -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060104/a87d29a1/attachment.html From seravilo at netzero.net Wed Jan 4 09:03:04 2006 From: seravilo at netzero.net (DOlivares) Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2006 09:03:04 -0600 Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! References: <003c01c60fa6$7d8788e0$6401a8c0@james0uw35t2hd> <000d01c60fc7$36f62f50$10f46942@coresys1> <43B9F57A.1080704@verizon.net> Message-ID: <002901c6113f$f7d48630$05f46942@coresys1> Yep, had all those bases covered before admitting to being STUMPED! FPR is brand-new; Conrad Cap and Rotor are brand-new, although only one bolt can be secured to the Distributor-- bizarre manufacturing flaw... anyone else ever see this? I just bought another one yesterday, but that won't fix this problem.... I've taken enough engines through hot pressure-washes to recognize and know how to defeat water in the Distributor as well: a screwdriver and a spray-can of ether! Keep trying, D.O. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Ted Metzing To: DOlivares Sent: Monday, January 02, 2006 9:54 PM Subject: Re: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Hey Dennis, I'm not all that great at diagnosing problems but when you said that you replaced the fuel pump to the Walbro, did you re-adjust the FPR? Maybe too much gas for a cold engine to burn off until warm? Or what about a crack in the distributor cap, letting moisture build up inside it from the previously warm motor (when off) then when cold the moisture is preventing the spark from arcing? Had a problem like that on my Harley with the coil-pack, wouldn't start until all moisture evaporated (warm day or a hot motor). These are just guesses, again not qualified as a problem solver. Good luck. Ted Metzing 93 TY #0190 06 Trailblazer SS DOlivares wrote: Thanks... so far, and happy New Year... et pax hominibus boni voluntatis! [You know who you are.] Unfortunately, I have tried all those diagnostic trees-- even a couple of bushes for good measure! This episode has been going on for nearly a month. As I said, I'm running out of hardware to swap-out. The only things I haven't diddled with is the EST Module in the Distributor and of course the ECM/chip. The reason I haven't fooled with those things is that the misbehavior complained of is SO PREDICTABLE and only afflicts COLD-START-UP conditions, except when it's really cold outside in which case I will get precisely ONE chug-a-lug spasm about 5 minutes into the run-up to full operating temperature... just after everything had been going just fine. That's the worst of it... as far as I can tell without a scantool... seat-of-the-pants power and smoothness is better than ever, otherwise. This is no "intermittent." This is pure predictability! And my experience with bad chips and modules is that they either fail outright or exhibit sporadic, random upsets... before failing outright. That's not what's occurring. Even so, I might drop in my spare EST (Holley Annihilator) just for laughs.... Keep thinking... what else could it be??? What's the connection to cold/cool ambient temperature? D.O. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ----- Original Message ----- From: Jim Sloan To: 'DOlivares' ; syty at syty.org Sent: Monday, January 02, 2006 8:11 AM Subject: RE: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Happy New Year Dennis! I've had hardware problems with several of the 10-1 adapters. You could swap back to the stock memcal (and map sensor) to rule that out, if your build isn't too radical. I usually keep at least one spare ecm for a substitution test, and have seen quite a few fail in weird ways. Let me know if you need one. Sometimes it helps to go back to the basics, and follow the diagnostics in the service manual http://syty.org/old/d&e-code44.html . Just a few ideas, if you haven't already tried them. Jim ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: syty-bounces at syty.org [mailto:syty-bounces at syty.org] On Behalf Of DOlivares Sent: Sunday, January 01, 2006 7:36 PM To: syty at syty.org Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Importance: High Who watches The Watcher? Who advises The Guru? Who assists The Good Samaritan? I think we're about to find out pretty soon-- at least until I can get my Lapdog running again (and one of the diagnostic programs to troubleshoot my li'l pony): Meanwhile, I NEED HELP! With my laptop in pieces all over the bench, I can't run DIACOM or DATALINK to give me clues about the usual suspects: Clean-livin' doesn't always pay off if my holidaze so far are any indication. I spent Christmas Eve on a carlift taking apart my right-front axle-- again!-- after being assured by our local "Gear-Guru" (who fully rebuilt that differential less than 6 months before I started hearing that same CLUNKING on left turns again) that all I needed was a new cir-clip (GM #14041989) to keep the axle from popping-out of the side-gear in the differential. HAH! More bad advice and I ended up taking a cab home.... More about that Horror Show in a later mailing. Meanwhile, we got our first technical freeze down here in what was becoming tropical San Antone on Nov. 17th and our first hard-freeze, appropriately, on Dec. 7th, and somewhere in between those times ol' Syclone #773 began throwing fits during start-up and for the first 5 or 6 minutes until the water jacket hits and stays at 180? or so. I'm stumped for the first time in a decade or more! Here's what happens: Since the new Walbro fuel-pump went in a few months ago, cranking times are way down... engine catches pretty quick, but now it won't stay lit and "choke" with the new IAC, which went in along with a new TPS and remote-adjustable FPR about a month before the new Walbro. Now, I have to feather the pedal once the ignition gets going and hold the throttle open a bit while the IAC hunts for about a dozen cycles making the tach swing about 1200 rpm back and forth until we hit the "sweet spot" and the engine takes off smoothly and the IAC-hunting stops, at least for a while. Now, it's safe to put her in gear and drive away as long as I keep a little positive bias in the pedal for the next few minutes every time I have to slow down to an idle or coast speed. THIS PROBLEM IS WICKEDLY WORSE ON COLD DAYS, where ambient air is in the 40s or below, which thankfully is rare. (Ain't this global-warming great!) However, on a couple of occasions when I did have to drive in the 30s-- and even after reaching full-warm-up temperature-- the engine starts cutting out seriously as the SES light comes on! Now, we're talking some MAJOR pumping of the pedal to keep things lit and if I can get on a clear piece of road and cruise a spell at 35 mph or better the problem goes away completely, until I shutdown and the engine gets cold again. I barely even recognize that SES light... hardly ever see it. Driving on warmer days never sees a recurrence of that mid-period cutting-out, and idle is smooth as is the rest of drivability. Warm start-ups see a few moments of that IAC-hunting, but the rpm-sweeps are only on the order of 500rpm and the whole anomaly goes away in about 30 seconds. I've NEVER encountered anything like this in my many years of wrenching! Now, it's time for some wretching!! All that ever gets logged in the way of a trouble-code is 44... not too helpful! Naturally, I replaced the O2 sensor-- no improvement at all! Everything described above instinctually told me this was a weird thermal transient in the injector-drive circuits or else the MAT, CTS or MAP I replaced (for the hell of it) 3 years ago needed to be switched again. So I did... one at a time to see if I could fault-locate the culprit that way. No dice! I'm running out of hardware to replace! I've even tried setting that 10-to-1 Chip to different settings, but the same nasty behavior persists-- the engine's as well as my own! WHO CAN TELL ME WHAT MY PROBLEM(S) IS? Be nice, now.... Dennis O. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Syty mailing list Syty at syty.org http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060104/18ac5717/attachment.html From seravilo at netzero.net Wed Jan 4 09:30:25 2006 From: seravilo at netzero.net (DOlivares) Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2006 09:30:25 -0600 Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! References: <9d.6eb7753f.30eb54e6@aol.com> Message-ID: <003101c61143$c9d4b800$05f46942@coresys1> Well, well, look who's.... Nope, I'm not gonna do it! It's a new year... time to wipe the slate clean ('til the next inevitable attack), so I will: ECM failures are either abrupt and total-- usually due to infant-semiconductor mortality of improperly screened parts or environmental/user damage-- or else they fail intermittently, i.e., RANDOMLY-- usually due to connection/grounding troubles or thermal transients. Now before you leap at "thermal," remember my hunt-and-dump problem is NOT RANDOM. It's totally temporary... confined strictly to the first 6 minutes or less of warm-up, depending on the ambient temp. Still, that doesn't mean I'm going to ignore your thoughtfully offered advice. It's just not going to be the very next fix-it I try. It may be the last thing I try, which probably means that's exactly what will end up working! If it does I will be the first to report and admit it. D.O. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Bullyhart at aol.com To: seravilo at netzero.net ; leroy at sunflower.com ; syty at syty.org Sent: Monday, January 02, 2006 10:17 PM Subject: Re: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! ECMs are susceptible to cold/heat just as much as the next electronic sensor. You have diddled with just about every other electronic part, I wouldn't be so quick to rule the ECM/chip out... They are easy to swap... Daron In a message dated 1/2/2006 12:07:38 P.M. Central Standard Time, seravilo at netzero.net writes: Keep thinking... what else could it be??? What's the connection to cold/cool ambient temperature? D.O. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060104/be7b2760/attachment.html From seravilo at netzero.net Wed Jan 4 09:46:55 2006 From: seravilo at netzero.net (DOlivares) Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2006 09:46:55 -0600 Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! References: <200601031439.JAA09003@theseus.cnc.net> Message-ID: <003f01c61146$18395030$05f46942@coresys1> Again, YOU may be right, but I remain skeptical. That 10-in-1 (push-button on faceplate changes program & LED designation) has been running like a top for well over 6 years. Unlike my PROMPAQ, it has no moving elements to wear out or degrade, except by ordinary random-axis vibration with which ALL electrical parts contend. That's why EEE-connectors are so tight (and even waterproof) and ruggedized these days. How come Todd doesn't pipe-up and defend the honor of his Products during all of this discussion? However, maybe my time has come-- or rather Austinsen's Chip-- to bite the dust! 6 years was a good enough run, I suppose. Still, WHY would scrolling through all those 10 resident programs produce exactly the same failure mode? I still think it's something else.... D.O. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Frank To: Bullyhart at aol.com ; syty at syty.org Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2006 8:39 AM Subject: Re: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! I will agree with Daron on this. Back in the old days when I had one of the original 10-1 chips by Todd A. this is exactly what happened. Cold winter day and engine stumbled and cut out a number of times. Put back original chip (which I always leave in the truck)and all was OK. By the way how old is your 10-1 chip? Is it the pin wheel type? Have not seen one for a long time. Frank Cleveland, OH. > wrote: > > ECMs are susceptible to cold/heat just as much as > the next electronic sensor. You have diddled with just > about every other electronic part, I wouldn't be so > quick to rule the ECM/chip out... They are easy to > swap... > Daron > > In a message dated 1/2/2006 12:07:38 P.M. Central > Standard Time, seravilo at netzero.net writes: > Keep thinking... what else could it be??? What's the connection to cold/cool > ambient temperature? > > D.O. > _______________________________________________ Syty mailing list Syty at syty.org http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060104/31b75070/attachment.html From seravilo at netzero.net Wed Jan 4 10:21:01 2006 From: seravilo at netzero.net (DOlivares) Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2006 10:21:01 -0600 Subject: [Syty] What is TV valve lifter rod? References: <20060103082639.35384.qmail@web80510.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <005401c6114a$db1c60c0$05f46942@coresys1> I don't know about that "exhaust" part, but I've been in enough of those Transmissions to know about that delicate TV-Lifter mechanism, which is actually only "delicate" when you're inside messing with the valve-body or various front-mounted valves/wiring with the pan OFF... jiggling things around the dipstick area. Once you button-up the pan, that S-shape bend at the end of the Bowden-type TV-Cable really cannot work its way out of the li'l hole in the Lifter-Arm's lever, provided you set it up right and adjust the 'Cable properly. Of course, if you never had the pan off in the first place-- and didn't ABUSE the TV-Cable by twisting it or jamming it in-and-out with undue, ape-like force-- you probably don't have to worry about its being disconnected from that Rod-end or the cable breaking. That twisted-steel cable is tough as railroad tie and you really have to WORK to kink it! Breaking or fraying the thing would require TOOLS and deliberate bad intentions. You just need to make sure you have the TV-Cable Bracket properly mounted to the manifold/TB and then do the throttle adjustment of said 'Cable by the book! I have the feeling you're doing the "mashing-down" of the gas pedal part, but you're FAILING to do the CRITICAL MECHANICAL RESET of the 'Cable itself, which is primordial and requires deliberate effort... along with a narrow pair of pliers... needle-nosers come to mind.... Well, did it work? D.O. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter To: syty Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2006 2:26 AM Subject: [Syty] What is TV valve lifter rod? Gentlemen, While working on the throttle body last night, I disconnected the TV cable. When I reconnected and took a test drive, the shift points are delayed and extremely hard. Section 7A1-58 of the service manual says something about the "TV valve lifter rod" dropping down to allow the TV exhaust ball to seat if the cable is broken, disconnected, or extremely out of adjustment. I think this is what happened. It then says if the transmission pan is removed, it should be possible to pull down on the TV exhaust valve lifter rod and let the springs return the rod to its normal up position. No pictures or other mention of the TV valve anywhere that I can find. Has this happened to anyone else? If so, any tips on correcting it? Thanks, Peter Albrecht -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ Syty mailing list Syty at syty.org http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060104/c4e9f59f/attachment.html From Bullyhart at aol.com Wed Jan 4 10:43:23 2006 From: Bullyhart at aol.com (Bullyhart at aol.com) Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2006 11:43:23 EST Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Message-ID: <2c3.1740a9e.30ed552b@aol.com> The ECM in our Typhoon ran like a top for 9 years, and then... You could have your answer regarding ECM/ Chip failure in less time than it takes to write one of your self appreciating emails.. Get to work. Daron In a message dated 1/4/2006 9:47:12 A.M. Central Standard Time, seravilo at netzero.net writes: Again, YOU may be right, but I remain skeptical. That 10-in-1 (push-button on faceplate changes program & LED designation) has been running like a top for well over 6 years. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060104/be88598f/attachment.html From seravilo at netzero.net Wed Jan 4 10:55:03 2006 From: seravilo at netzero.net (DOlivares) Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2006 10:55:03 -0600 Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! References: <2c3.1740a9e.30ed552b@aol.com> Message-ID: <006001c6114f$a0cac650$05f46942@coresys1> You're fast making me REGRET my New Year's Resolution... don't push it! ----- Original Message ----- From: Bullyhart at aol.com To: seravilo at netzero.net ; tyfoon at concentric.net ; syty at syty.org Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2006 10:43 AM Subject: Re: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! The ECM in our Typhoon ran like a top for 9 years, and then... You could have your answer regarding ECM/ Chip failure in less time than it takes to write one of your self appreciating emails.. Get to work. Daron In a message dated 1/4/2006 9:47:12 A.M. Central Standard Time, seravilo at netzero.net writes: Again, YOU may be right, but I remain skeptical. That 10-in-1 (push-button on faceplate changes program & LED designation) has been running like a top for well over 6 years. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060104/724b187c/attachment.html From seravilo at netzero.net Wed Jan 4 10:58:26 2006 From: seravilo at netzero.net (DOlivares) Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2006 10:58:26 -0600 Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! References: <2c3.1740a9e.30ed552b@aol.com> Message-ID: <006701c61150$15435d30$05f46942@coresys1> ...besides, when you (ever) get to my level of maturity, you'll find your sense of adventure, energy, and especially TIME tend to dwindle. Thus, writing e-mails has become more enjoyable than wasting the hours of misspent youth under a hood! D.O. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Bullyhart at aol.com To: seravilo at netzero.net ; tyfoon at concentric.net ; syty at syty.org Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2006 10:43 AM Subject: Re: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! The ECM in our Typhoon ran like a top for 9 years, and then... You could have your answer regarding ECM/ Chip failure in less time than it takes to write one of your self appreciating emails.. Get to work. Daron In a message dated 1/4/2006 9:47:12 A.M. Central Standard Time, seravilo at netzero.net writes: Again, YOU may be right, but I remain skeptical. That 10-in-1 (push-button on faceplate changes program & LED designation) has been running like a top for well over 6 years. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060104/20cd760f/attachment.html From lewisstraughn at netscape.com Wed Jan 4 11:14:27 2006 From: lewisstraughn at netscape.com (Lewis Straughn) Date: Wed, 04 Jan 2006 12:14:27 -0500 Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! In-Reply-To: <002901c6113f$f7d48630$05f46942@coresys1> References: <003c01c60fa6$7d8788e0$6401a8c0@james0uw35t2hd> <000d01c60fc7$36f62f50$10f46942@coresys1> <43B9F57A.1080704@verizon.net> <002901c6113f$f7d48630$05f46942@coresys1> Message-ID: <43BC0273.5000301@netscape.com> Dennis, I had the same problem with the screws in the distributor cap and that will cause the problem you are having. I know it is hard to get to that screw, but what I had to do was just get one screw started a couple of turns and then get the other one going and then be sure I had the cap pushed down to the bottom and seated in position and then tighten each screw a little at the time until I had them both tight. I don't know why it is so hard to get the cap in position, but it is and when you get it you will know it. I had to walk away a couple of times because it was a job for Houdini. Hope that helps, Lewis Straughn DOlivares wrote: > Yep, had /all/ those bases covered before admitting to being STUMPED! > > FPR is brand-new; Conrad Cap and Rotor are brand-new, although /only > one bolt can be secured/ to the Distributor-- bizarre manufacturing > flaw... anyone else ever see this? I just bought another one > yesterday, but that /won't/ fix this problem.... > > I've taken enough engines through hot pressure-washes to recognize and > know how to defeat water in the Distributor as well: a screwdriver > and a spray-can of ether! > > Keep trying, > > D.O. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* Ted Metzing > *To:* DOlivares > *Sent:* Monday, January 02, 2006 9:54 PM > *Subject:* Re: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! > > Hey Dennis, I'm not all that great at diagnosing problems but when you > said that you replaced the fuel pump to the Walbro, did you re-adjust > the FPR? Maybe too much gas for a cold engine to burn off until warm? > Or what about a crack in the distributor cap, letting moisture build > up inside it from the previously warm motor (when off) then when cold > the moisture is preventing the spark from arcing? Had a problem like > that on my Harley with the coil-pack, wouldn't start until all > moisture evaporated (warm day or a hot motor). These are just guesses, > again not qualified as a problem solver. Good luck. > > Ted Metzing > 93 TY #0190 > 06 Trailblazer SS > > > DOlivares wrote: > >> Thanks... so far, and happy New Year... /et pax hominibus boni >> voluntatis!/ >> [You know who you are.] >> >> Unfortunately, I have /tried/ all those diagnostic trees-- even a >> couple of bushes for good measure! This episode has been going on >> for nearly a month. As I said, I'm running out of hardware to >> swap-out. The only things I haven't diddled with is the *EST Module* >> in the Distributor and of course the *ECM/chip*. >> >> The reason I haven't fooled with those things is that the misbehavior >> complained of is SO PREDICTABLE and only afflicts COLD-START-UP >> conditions, except when it's really cold outside in which case I will >> get precisely ONE chug-a-lug spasm about 5 minutes into the run-up to >> full operating temperature... just after everything had been going >> just fine. That's the worst of it... as far as I can tell without a >> scantool... seat-of-the-pants power and smoothness is better than >> ever, otherwise. This is no "intermittent." This is pure >> predictability! And my experience with bad chips and modules is that >> they either fail outright or exhibit sporadic, random upsets... >> before failing outright. That's not what's occurring. Even so, I >> might drop in my spare EST (Holley Annihilator) just for laughs.... >> >> Keep thinking... what /else/ could it be??? What's the connection to >> cold/cool ambient temperature? >> >> D.O. >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> ----- Original Message ----- >> *From:* Jim Sloan >> *To:* 'DOlivares' ; syty at syty.org >> >> *Sent:* Monday, January 02, 2006 8:11 AM >> *Subject:* RE: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! >> >> Happy New Year Dennis! >> >> I've had hardware problems with several of the 10-1 adapters. You >> could swap back to the stock memcal (and map sensor) to rule that >> out, if your build isn't too radical. >> >> I usually keep at least one spare ecm for a substitution test, and >> have seen quite a few fail in weird ways. Let me know if you need one. >> >> Sometimes it helps to go back to the basics, and follow the >> diagnostics in the service manual http://syty.org/old/d&e-code44.html >> . >> >> Just a few ideas, if you haven't already tried them. >> >> Jim >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> *From:* syty-bounces at syty.org [mailto:syty-bounces at syty.org] *On >> Behalf Of *DOlivares >> *Sent:* Sunday, January 01, 2006 7:36 PM >> *To:* syty at syty.org >> *Subject:* [Syty] Broke & Stumped! >> *Importance:* High >> >> Who watches The Watcher? >> >> Who advises The Guru? >> >> Who assists The Good Samaritan? >> >> I think we're about to find out pretty soon-- at least until I >> can get my Lapdog running again (and one of the diagnostic >> programs to troubleshoot my li'l pony): >> >> Meanwhile, I NEED HELP! With my laptop in pieces all over the >> bench, I can't run DIACOM or DATALINK to give me clues about the >> usual suspects: >> >> Clean-livin' doesn't always pay off if my holidaze so far are any >> indication. I spent Christmas Eve on a carlift taking apart my >> right-front axle-- again!-- after being assured by our local >> "Gear-Guru" (who fully rebuilt that differential less than 6 >> months before I started hearing that same CLUNKING on left turns >> again) that all I needed was a new cir-clip (GM #14041989) to >> keep the axle from popping-out of the side-gear in the >> differential. HAH! More bad advice and I ended up taking a cab >> home.... More about that Horror Show in a later mailing. >> >> Meanwhile, we got our first technical freeze down here in what >> was becoming /tropical/ San Antone on Nov. 17th and our first >> hard-freeze, appropriately, on Dec. 7th, and somewhere in between >> those times ol' Syclone #773 began *throwing fits during start-up >> and for the first 5 or 6 minutes until the water jacket hits and >> stays at 180?* or so. I'm stumped for the first time in a decade >> or more! Here's what happens: >> >> Since the /new/ Walbro fuel-pump went in a few months ago, >> cranking times are way down... engine catches pretty quick, but >> now it won't stay lit and "choke" with the /new/ IAC, which went >> in along with a /new/ TPS and remote-adjustable FPR about a month >> before the new Walbro. Now, I have to feather the pedal once the >> ignition gets going and hold the throttle open a bit while the >> IAC hunts for about a dozen cycles making the tach swing about >> 1200 rpm back and forth until we hit the "sweet spot" and the >> engine takes off smoothly and the IAC-hunting stops, at least for >> a while. Now, it's safe to put her in gear and drive away as >> long as I keep a little positive bias in the pedal for the next >> few minutes every time I have to slow down to an idle or coast >> speed. >> >> THIS PROBLEM IS WICKEDLY WORSE ON COLD DAYS, where ambient air is >> in the 40s or below, which thankfully is rare. (Ain't this >> global-warming great!) However, on a couple of occasions when I >> did have to drive in the 30s-- and even /after/ reaching >> full-warm-up temperature-- the engine starts cutting out >> seriously as the SES light comes on! Now, we're talking some >> MAJOR pumping of the pedal to keep things lit and if I can get on >> a clear piece of road and cruise a spell at 35 mph or better the >> problem goes away /completely/, until I shutdown and the engine >> gets cold again. I barely even recognize that SES light... >> hardly ever see it. Driving on warmer days never sees a >> recurrence of that mid-period cutting-out, and idle is smooth as >> is the rest of drivability. Warm start-ups see a few moments of >> that IAC-hunting, but the rpm-sweeps are only on the order of >> 500rpm and the whole anomaly goes away in about 30 seconds. I've >> NEVER encountered anything like this in my many years of >> wrenching! Now, it's time for some wretching!! All that ever >> gets logged in the way of a trouble-code is *44*... not too helpful! >> >> Naturally, I replaced the O2 sensor-- no improvement at all! >> Everything described above instinctually told me this was a weird >> thermal transient in the injector-drive circuits or else the MAT, >> CTS or MAP I replaced (for the hell of it) 3 years ago needed to >> be switched again. So I /did/... one at a time to see if I could >> fault-locate the culprit that way. No dice! I'm running out of >> hardware to replace! I've even tried setting that 10-to-1 Chip >> to different settings, but the same nasty behavior persists-- the >> engine's as well as my own! >> >> *WHO CAN TELL ME WHAT MY PROBLEM(S) IS?* Be nice, now.... >> >> Dennis O. >> >> >>------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >>_______________________________________________ >>Syty mailing list >>Syty at syty.org >>http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty >> >> > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >_______________________________________________ >Syty mailing list >Syty at syty.org >http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060104/71727d05/attachment.html From seravilo at netzero.net Wed Jan 4 11:36:52 2006 From: seravilo at netzero.net (DOlivares) Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2006 11:36:52 -0600 Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! References: <003c01c60fa6$7d8788e0$6401a8c0@james0uw35t2hd> <000d01c60fc7$36f62f50$10f46942@coresys1> <43B9F57A.1080704@verizon.net> <002901c6113f$f7d48630$05f46942@coresys1> <43BC0273.5000301@netscape.com> Message-ID: <007101c61155$740b5570$05f46942@coresys1> You're right as rain about the need for acrobatic ability especially when working on anything around that Distributor; the cramped Syclones are far worse that the 'Phoons! And that's one of the reasons-- THE PAIN-- I don't like to go diddling under that Hood anymore unless I know exactly what I want to do there and why. However, my single-bolted Distributor Cap is the last among several I have managed to replace... have lots of practice and a special hex-wrench rigged-up for just that purpose. The Cap is NOT LOOSE and has been smoothly running since early July (when I also replaced the FPR, IAC, TPS, and the Rotor). The Cap simply WON'T FIT! I can screw-down ONE bolt but not the other-- take your pick! The screw-hole in the newest Cap is simply cast/molded wrong. Later, I'm going to try to get it replaced provided I can find a new one in RED. (The one I got a few daze ago was dark gray.) Thanx anyway, D.O. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Lewis Straughn To: DOlivares ; syty at syty.org Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2006 11:14 AM Subject: Re: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Dennis, I had the same problem with the screws in the distributor cap and that will cause the problem you are having. I know it is hard to get to that screw, but what I had to do was just get one screw started a couple of turns and then get the other one going and then be sure I had the cap pushed down to the bottom and seated in position and then tighten each screw a little at the time until I had them both tight. I don't know why it is so hard to get the cap in position, but it is and when you get it you will know it. I had to walk away a couple of times because it was a job for Houdini. Hope that helps, Lewis Straughn DOlivares wrote: Yep, had all those bases covered before admitting to being STUMPED! FPR is brand-new; Conrad Cap and Rotor are brand-new, although only one bolt can be secured to the Distributor-- bizarre manufacturing flaw... anyone else ever see this? I just bought another one yesterday, but that won't fix this problem.... I've taken enough engines through hot pressure-washes to recognize and know how to defeat water in the Distributor as well: a screwdriver and a spray-can of ether! Keep trying, D.O. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ----- Original Message ----- From: Ted Metzing To: DOlivares Sent: Monday, January 02, 2006 9:54 PM Subject: Re: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Hey Dennis, I'm not all that great at diagnosing problems but when you said that you replaced the fuel pump to the Walbro, did you re-adjust the FPR? Maybe too much gas for a cold engine to burn off until warm? Or what about a crack in the distributor cap, letting moisture build up inside it from the previously warm motor (when off) then when cold the moisture is preventing the spark from arcing? Had a problem like that on my Harley with the coil-pack, wouldn't start until all moisture evaporated (warm day or a hot motor). These are just guesses, again not qualified as a problem solver. Good luck. Ted Metzing 93 TY #0190 06 Trailblazer SS DOlivares wrote: Thanks... so far, and happy New Year... et pax hominibus boni voluntatis! [You know who you are.] Unfortunately, I have tried all those diagnostic trees-- even a couple of bushes for good measure! This episode has been going on for nearly a month. As I said, I'm running out of hardware to swap-out. The only things I haven't diddled with is the EST Module in the Distributor and of course the ECM/chip. The reason I haven't fooled with those things is that the misbehavior complained of is SO PREDICTABLE and only afflicts COLD-START-UP conditions, except when it's really cold outside in which case I will get precisely ONE chug-a-lug spasm about 5 minutes into the run-up to full operating temperature... just after everything had been going just fine. That's the worst of it... as far as I can tell without a scantool... seat-of-the-pants power and smoothness is better than ever, otherwise. This is no "intermittent." This is pure predictability! And my experience with bad chips and modules is that they either fail outright or exhibit sporadic, random upsets... before failing outright. That's not what's occurring. Even so, I might drop in my spare EST (Holley Annihilator) just for laughs.... Keep thinking... what else could it be??? What's the connection to cold/cool ambient temperature? D.O. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Jim Sloan To: 'DOlivares' ; syty at syty.org Sent: Monday, January 02, 2006 8:11 AM Subject: RE: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Happy New Year Dennis! I've had hardware problems with several of the 10-1 adapters. You could swap back to the stock memcal (and map sensor) to rule that out, if your build isn't too radical. I usually keep at least one spare ecm for a substitution test, and have seen quite a few fail in weird ways. Let me know if you need one. Sometimes it helps to go back to the basics, and follow the diagnostics in the service manual http://syty.org/old/d&e-code44.html . Just a few ideas, if you haven't already tried them. Jim -------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: syty-bounces at syty.org [mailto:syty-bounces at syty.org] On Behalf Of DOlivares Sent: Sunday, January 01, 2006 7:36 PM To: syty at syty.org Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Importance: High Who watches The Watcher? Who advises The Guru? Who assists The Good Samaritan? I think we're about to find out pretty soon-- at least until I can get my Lapdog running again (and one of the diagnostic programs to troubleshoot my li'l pony): Meanwhile, I NEED HELP! With my laptop in pieces all over the bench, I can't run DIACOM or DATALINK to give me clues about the usual suspects: Clean-livin' doesn't always pay off if my holidaze so far are any indication. I spent Christmas Eve on a carlift taking apart my right-front axle-- again!-- after being assured by our local "Gear-Guru" (who fully rebuilt that differential less than 6 months before I started hearing that same CLUNKING on left turns again) that all I needed was a new cir-clip (GM #14041989) to keep the axle from popping-out of the side-gear in the differential. HAH! More bad advice and I ended up taking a cab home.... More about that Horror Show in a later mailing. Meanwhile, we got our first technical freeze down here in what was becoming tropical San Antone on Nov. 17th and our first hard-freeze, appropriately, on Dec. 7th, and somewhere in between those times ol' Syclone #773 began throwing fits during start-up and for the first 5 or 6 minutes until the water jacket hits and stays at 180? or so. I'm stumped for the first time in a decade or more! Here's what happens: Since the new Walbro fuel-pump went in a few months ago, cranking times are way down... engine catches pretty quick, but now it won't stay lit and "choke" with the new IAC, which went in along with a new TPS and remote-adjustable FPR about a month before the new Walbro. Now, I have to feather the pedal once the ignition gets going and hold the throttle open a bit while the IAC hunts for about a dozen cycles making the tach swing about 1200 rpm back and forth until we hit the "sweet spot" and the engine takes off smoothly and the IAC-hunting stops, at least for a while. Now, it's safe to put her in gear and drive away as long as I keep a little positive bias in the pedal for the next few minutes every time I have to slow down to an idle or coast speed. THIS PROBLEM IS WICKEDLY WORSE ON COLD DAYS, where ambient air is in the 40s or below, which thankfully is rare. (Ain't this global-warming great!) However, on a couple of occasions when I did have to drive in the 30s-- and even after reaching full-warm-up temperature-- the engine starts cutting out seriously as the SES light comes on! Now, we're talking some MAJOR pumping of the pedal to keep things lit and if I can get on a clear piece of road and cruise a spell at 35 mph or better the problem goes away completely, until I shutdown and the engine gets cold again. I barely even recognize that SES light... hardly ever see it. Driving on warmer days never sees a recurrence of that mid-period cutting-out, and idle is smooth as is the rest of drivability. Warm start-ups see a few moments of that IAC-hunting, but the rpm-sweeps are only on the order of 500rpm and the whole anomaly goes away in about 30 seconds. I've NEVER encountered anything like this in my many years of wrenching! Now, it's time for some wretching!! All that ever gets logged in the way of a trouble-code is 44... not too helpful! Naturally, I replaced the O2 sensor-- no improvement at all! Everything described above instinctually told me this was a weird thermal transient in the injector-drive circuits or else the MAT, CTS or MAP I replaced (for the hell of it) 3 years ago needed to be switched again. So I did... one at a time to see if I could fault-locate the culprit that way. No dice! I'm running out of hardware to replace! I've even tried setting that 10-to-1 Chip to different settings, but the same nasty behavior persists-- the engine's as well as my own! WHO CAN TELL ME WHAT MY PROBLEM(S) IS? Be nice, now.... Dennis O. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ Syty mailing list Syty at syty.org http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Syty mailing list Syty at syty.org http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060104/95282ac1/attachment.html From lewisstraughn at netscape.com Wed Jan 4 11:41:12 2006 From: lewisstraughn at netscape.com (Lewis Straughn) Date: Wed, 04 Jan 2006 12:41:12 -0500 Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! In-Reply-To: <43BC0273.5000301@netscape.com> References: <003c01c60fa6$7d8788e0$6401a8c0@james0uw35t2hd> <000d01c60fc7$36f62f50$10f46942@coresys1> <43B9F57A.1080704@verizon.net> <002901c6113f$f7d48630$05f46942@coresys1> <43BC0273.5000301@netscape.com> Message-ID: <43BC08B8.6030704@netscape.com> PS: The US Government put out a contract back in the early 50's for a solution to the old Jeeps that when driven through streams and the like would get water in the electrical system and they needed something that would work to displace the water quickly and allow the troupes to move on. The company that finally got the answer tried 40 times with various compounds before they were successful. The reason was it had to allow electrical current to continue and not be blocked by the compound. They named the product WD-40 (Water Displacement - 40th try) There are so many uses that were found for this miracle spray later, but many have forgotten it's original purpose. WD-40 is cheaper than ether and easier to find. Here is the website that has the details of the history of WD40, read the second paragraph. http://www.wd40.com/AboutUs/our_history.html A little trivia, Lewis Straughn Lewis Straughn wrote: > Dennis, > > I had the same problem with the screws in the distributor cap and that > will cause the problem you are having. I know it is hard to get to > that screw, but what I had to do was just get one screw started a > couple of turns and then get the other one going and then be sure I > had the cap pushed down to the bottom and seated in position and then > tighten each screw a little at the time until I had them both tight. I > don't know why it is so hard to get the cap in position, but it is and > when you get it you will know it. I had to walk away a couple of times > because it was a job for Houdini. > > Hope that helps, > Lewis Straughn > > DOlivares wrote: > >> Yep, had /all/ those bases covered before admitting to being STUMPED! >> >> FPR is brand-new; Conrad Cap and Rotor are brand-new, although /only >> one bolt can be secured/ to the Distributor-- bizarre manufacturing >> flaw... anyone else ever see this? I just bought another one >> yesterday, but that /won't/ fix this problem.... >> >> I've taken enough engines through hot pressure-washes to recognize >> and know how to defeat water in the Distributor as well: a >> screwdriver and a spray-can of ether! >> >> Keep trying, >> >> D.O. >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> *From:* Ted Metzing >> *To:* DOlivares >> *Sent:* Monday, January 02, 2006 9:54 PM >> *Subject:* Re: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! >> >> Hey Dennis, I'm not all that great at diagnosing problems but when >> you said that you replaced the fuel pump to the Walbro, did you >> re-adjust the FPR? Maybe too much gas for a cold engine to burn off >> until warm? Or what about a crack in the distributor cap, letting >> moisture build up inside it from the previously warm motor (when off) >> then when cold the moisture is preventing the spark from arcing? Had >> a problem like that on my Harley with the coil-pack, wouldn't start >> until all moisture evaporated (warm day or a hot motor). These are >> just guesses, again not qualified as a problem solver. Good luck. >> >> Ted Metzing >> 93 TY #0190 >> 06 Trailblazer SS >> >> >> DOlivares wrote: >> >>> Thanks... so far, and happy New Year... /et pax hominibus boni >>> voluntatis!/ >>> [You know who you are.] >>> >>> Unfortunately, I have /tried/ all those diagnostic trees-- even a >>> couple of bushes for good measure! This episode has been going on >>> for nearly a month. As I said, I'm running out of hardware to >>> swap-out. The only things I haven't diddled with is the *EST >>> Module* in the Distributor and of course the *ECM/chip*. >>> >>> The reason I haven't fooled with those things is that the >>> misbehavior complained of is SO PREDICTABLE and only afflicts >>> COLD-START-UP conditions, except when it's really cold outside in >>> which case I will get precisely ONE chug-a-lug spasm about 5 minutes >>> into the run-up to full operating temperature... just after >>> everything had been going just fine. That's the worst of it... as >>> far as I can tell without a scantool... seat-of-the-pants power and >>> smoothness is better than ever, otherwise. This is no >>> "intermittent." This is pure predictability! And my experience >>> with bad chips and modules is that they either fail outright or >>> exhibit sporadic, random upsets... before failing outright. That's >>> not what's occurring. Even so, I might drop in my spare EST (Holley >>> Annihilator) just for laughs.... >>> >>> Keep thinking... what /else/ could it be??? What's the connection >>> to cold/cool ambient temperature? >>> >>> D.O. >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> *From:* Jim Sloan >>> *To:* 'DOlivares' ; syty at syty.org >>> >>> *Sent:* Monday, January 02, 2006 8:11 AM >>> *Subject:* RE: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! >>> >>> Happy New Year Dennis! >>> >>> I've had hardware problems with several of the 10-1 adapters. You >>> could swap back to the stock memcal (and map sensor) to rule that >>> out, if your build isn't too radical. >>> >>> I usually keep at least one spare ecm for a substitution test, and >>> have seen quite a few fail in weird ways. Let me know if you need one. >>> >>> Sometimes it helps to go back to the basics, and follow the >>> diagnostics in the service manual >>> http://syty.org/old/d&e-code44.html >>> . >>> >>> Just a few ideas, if you haven't already tried them. >>> >>> Jim >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> *From:* syty-bounces at syty.org [mailto:syty-bounces at syty.org] *On >>> Behalf Of *DOlivares >>> *Sent:* Sunday, January 01, 2006 7:36 PM >>> *To:* syty at syty.org >>> *Subject:* [Syty] Broke & Stumped! >>> *Importance:* High >>> >>> Who watches The Watcher? >>> >>> Who advises The Guru? >>> >>> Who assists The Good Samaritan? >>> >>> I think we're about to find out pretty soon-- at least until I >>> can get my Lapdog running again (and one of the diagnostic >>> programs to troubleshoot my li'l pony): >>> >>> Meanwhile, I NEED HELP! With my laptop in pieces all over the >>> bench, I can't run DIACOM or DATALINK to give me clues about the >>> usual suspects: >>> >>> Clean-livin' doesn't always pay off if my holidaze so far are >>> any indication. I spent Christmas Eve on a carlift taking apart >>> my right-front axle-- again!-- after being assured by our local >>> "Gear-Guru" (who fully rebuilt that differential less than 6 >>> months before I started hearing that same CLUNKING on left turns >>> again) that all I needed was a new cir-clip (GM #14041989) to >>> keep the axle from popping-out of the side-gear in the >>> differential. HAH! More bad advice and I ended up taking a cab >>> home.... More about that Horror Show in a later mailing. >>> >>> Meanwhile, we got our first technical freeze down here in what >>> was becoming /tropical/ San Antone on Nov. 17th and our first >>> hard-freeze, appropriately, on Dec. 7th, and somewhere in >>> between those times ol' Syclone #773 began *throwing fits during >>> start-up and for the first 5 or 6 minutes until the water jacket >>> hits and stays at 180?* or so. I'm stumped for the first time >>> in a decade or more! Here's what happens: >>> >>> Since the /new/ Walbro fuel-pump went in a few months ago, >>> cranking times are way down... engine catches pretty quick, but >>> now it won't stay lit and "choke" with the /new/ IAC, which went >>> in along with a /new/ TPS and remote-adjustable FPR about a >>> month before the new Walbro. Now, I have to feather the pedal >>> once the ignition gets going and hold the throttle open a bit >>> while the IAC hunts for about a dozen cycles making the tach >>> swing about 1200 rpm back and forth until we hit the "sweet >>> spot" and the engine takes off smoothly and the IAC-hunting >>> stops, at least for a while. Now, it's safe to put her in gear >>> and drive away as long as I keep a little positive bias in the >>> pedal for the next few minutes every time I have to slow down to >>> an idle or coast speed. >>> >>> THIS PROBLEM IS WICKEDLY WORSE ON COLD DAYS, where ambient >>> air is in the 40s or below, which thankfully is rare. (Ain't >>> this global-warming great!) However, on a couple of occasions >>> when I did have to drive in the 30s-- and even /after/ reaching >>> full-warm-up temperature-- the engine starts cutting out >>> seriously as the SES light comes on! Now, we're talking some >>> MAJOR pumping of the pedal to keep things lit and if I can get >>> on a clear piece of road and cruise a spell at 35 mph or better >>> the problem goes away /completely/, until I shutdown and the >>> engine gets cold again. I barely even recognize that SES >>> light... hardly ever see it. Driving on warmer days never sees >>> a recurrence of that mid-period cutting-out, and idle is smooth >>> as is the rest of drivability. Warm start-ups see a few moments >>> of that IAC-hunting, but the rpm-sweeps are only on the order of >>> 500rpm and the whole anomaly goes away in about 30 seconds. >>> I've NEVER encountered anything like this in my many years of >>> wrenching! Now, it's time for some wretching!! All that ever >>> gets logged in the way of a trouble-code is *44*... not too helpful! >>> >>> Naturally, I replaced the O2 sensor-- no improvement at all! >>> Everything described above instinctually told me this was a >>> weird thermal transient in the injector-drive circuits or else >>> the MAT, CTS or MAP I replaced (for the hell of it) 3 years ago >>> needed to be switched again. So I /did/... one at a time to see >>> if I could fault-locate the culprit that way. No dice! I'm >>> running out of hardware to replace! I've even tried setting >>> that 10-to-1 Chip to different settings, but the same nasty >>> behavior persists-- the engine's as well as my own! >>> >>> *WHO CAN TELL ME WHAT MY PROBLEM(S) IS?* Be nice, now.... >>> >>> Dennis O. >>> >>> >>>------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> >>>_______________________________________________ >>>Syty mailing list >>>Syty at syty.org >>>http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty >>> >>> >> >>------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >>_______________________________________________ >>Syty mailing list >>Syty at syty.org >>http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty >> >> >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >_______________________________________________ >Syty mailing list >Syty at syty.org >http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060104/0e2a2848/attachment.html From brassmonkey at ec.rr.com Wed Jan 4 11:52:13 2006 From: brassmonkey at ec.rr.com (Mel) Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2006 12:52:13 -0500 Subject: Fw: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Message-ID: <008a01c61157$97fdafd0$47f83842@mgochnour> I keep WD-40 in all my vehicles just for that problem Lewis. Cruzin' Mel Man Semper Fi Keep your fork ----- Original Message ----- From: Lewis Straughn To: undisclosed-recipients: Cc: syty at syty.org Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2006 12:41 PM Subject: Re: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! PS: The US Government put out a contract back in the early 50's for a solution to the old Jeeps that when driven through streams and the like would get water in the electrical system and they needed something that would work to displace the water quickly and allow the troupes to move on. The company that finally got the answer tried 40 times with various compounds before they were successful. The reason was it had to allow electrical current to continue and not be blocked by the compound. They named the product WD-40 (Water Displacement - 40th try) There are so many uses that were found for this miracle spray later, but many have forgotten it's original purpose. WD-40 is cheaper than ether and easier to find. Here is the website that has the details of the history of WD40, read the second paragraph. http://www.wd40.com/AboutUs/our_history.html A little trivia, Lewis Straughn -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060104/15c9518e/attachment.html From seravilo at netzero.net Wed Jan 4 11:59:49 2006 From: seravilo at netzero.net (DOlivares) Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2006 11:59:49 -0600 Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! References: <003c01c60fa6$7d8788e0$6401a8c0@james0uw35t2hd> <000d01c60fc7$36f62f50$10f46942@coresys1> <43B9F57A.1080704@verizon.net> <002901c6113f$f7d48630$05f46942@coresys1> <43BC0273.5000301@netscape.com> <43BC08B8.6030704@netscape.com> Message-ID: <008001c61158$a8db33d0$05f46942@coresys1> Not quite... I buy my Ether (a.k.a. Starting Fluid) in bulk at 99? per 12oz spraycan. Ya can't get even a mini-can of WD-40 for that kinda dough anymore. Plus, ether evaporates fast, taking all the adsorbed water with it, doesn't linger on and thereby degrade/dissolve the plastic surface dist-cap, and leaves no or little residue, unlike WD-40, which can slowly oxidize and gunk-up the 'cap with all that arcing and ozone.... And sniffing ether is almost as good as sniffing airplane glue... for those of you so inclined! I liked the history lesson though. NASA gave us Tang and teflon; the Army gave us WD-40... makes me feel proud every April 15th...! D.O. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Lewis Straughn To: undisclosed-recipients: Cc: DOlivares ; syty at syty.org Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2006 11:41 AM Subject: Re: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! PS: The US Government put out a contract back in the early 50's for a solution to the old Jeeps that when driven through streams and the like would get water in the electrical system and they needed something that would work to displace the water quickly and allow the troupes to move on. The company that finally got the answer tried 40 times with various compounds before they were successful. The reason was it had to allow electrical current to continue and not be blocked by the compound. They named the product WD-40 (Water Displacement - 40th try) There are so many uses that were found for this miracle spray later, but many have forgotten it's original purpose. WD-40 is cheaper than ether and easier to find. Here is the website that has the details of the history of WD40, read the second paragraph. http://www.wd40.com/AboutUs/our_history.html A little trivia, Lewis Straughn Lewis Straughn wrote: Dennis, I had the same problem with the screws in the distributor cap and that will cause the problem you are having. I know it is hard to get to that screw, but what I had to do was just get one screw started a couple of turns and then get the other one going and then be sure I had the cap pushed down to the bottom and seated in position and then tighten each screw a little at the time until I had them both tight. I don't know why it is so hard to get the cap in position, but it is and when you get it you will know it. I had to walk away a couple of times because it was a job for Houdini. Hope that helps, Lewis Straughn DOlivares wrote: Yep, had all those bases covered before admitting to being STUMPED! FPR is brand-new; Conrad Cap and Rotor are brand-new, although only one bolt can be secured to the Distributor-- bizarre manufacturing flaw... anyone else ever see this? I just bought another one yesterday, but that won't fix this problem.... I've taken enough engines through hot pressure-washes to recognize and know how to defeat water in the Distributor as well: a screwdriver and a spray-can of ether! Keep trying, D.O. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Ted Metzing To: DOlivares Sent: Monday, January 02, 2006 9:54 PM Subject: Re: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Hey Dennis, I'm not all that great at diagnosing problems but when you said that you replaced the fuel pump to the Walbro, did you re-adjust the FPR? Maybe too much gas for a cold engine to burn off until warm? Or what about a crack in the distributor cap, letting moisture build up inside it from the previously warm motor (when off) then when cold the moisture is preventing the spark from arcing? Had a problem like that on my Harley with the coil-pack, wouldn't start until all moisture evaporated (warm day or a hot motor). These are just guesses, again not qualified as a problem solver. Good luck. Ted Metzing 93 TY #0190 06 Trailblazer SS DOlivares wrote: Thanks... so far, and happy New Year... et pax hominibus boni voluntatis! [You know who you are.] Unfortunately, I have tried all those diagnostic trees-- even a couple of bushes for good measure! This episode has been going on for nearly a month. As I said, I'm running out of hardware to swap-out. The only things I haven't diddled with is the EST Module in the Distributor and of course the ECM/chip. The reason I haven't fooled with those things is that the misbehavior complained of is SO PREDICTABLE and only afflicts COLD-START-UP conditions, except when it's really cold outside in which case I will get precisely ONE chug-a-lug spasm about 5 minutes into the run-up to full operating temperature... just after everything had been going just fine. That's the worst of it... as far as I can tell without a scantool... seat-of-the-pants power and smoothness is better than ever, otherwise. This is no "intermittent." This is pure predictability! And my experience with bad chips and modules is that they either fail outright or exhibit sporadic, random upsets... before failing outright. That's not what's occurring. Even so, I might drop in my spare EST (Holley Annihilator) just for laughs.... Keep thinking... what else could it be??? What's the connection to cold/cool ambient temperature? D.O. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Jim Sloan To: 'DOlivares' ; syty at syty.org Sent: Monday, January 02, 2006 8:11 AM Subject: RE: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Happy New Year Dennis! I've had hardware problems with several of the 10-1 adapters. You could swap back to the stock memcal (and map sensor) to rule that out, if your build isn't too radical. I usually keep at least one spare ecm for a substitution test, and have seen quite a few fail in weird ways. Let me know if you need one. Sometimes it helps to go back to the basics, and follow the diagnostics in the service manual http://syty.org/old/d&e-code44.html . Just a few ideas, if you haven't already tried them. Jim ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From: syty-bounces at syty.org [mailto:syty-bounces at syty.org] On Behalf Of DOlivares Sent: Sunday, January 01, 2006 7:36 PM To: syty at syty.org Subject: [Syty] Broke & Stumped! Importance: High Who watches The Watcher? Who advises The Guru? Who assists The Good Samaritan? I think we're about to find out pretty soon-- at least until I can get my Lapdog running again (and one of the diagnostic programs to troubleshoot my li'l pony): Meanwhile, I NEED HELP! With my laptop in pieces all over the bench, I can't run DIACOM or DATALINK to give me clues about the usual suspects: Clean-livin' doesn't always pay off if my holidaze so far are any indication. I spent Christmas Eve on a carlift taking apart my right-front axle-- again!-- after being assured by our local "Gear-Guru" (who fully rebuilt that differential less than 6 months before I started hearing that same CLUNKING on left turns again) that all I needed was a new cir-clip (GM #14041989) to keep the axle from popping-out of the side-gear in the differential. HAH! More bad advice and I ended up taking a cab home.... More about that Horror Show in a later mailing. Meanwhile, we got our first technical freeze down here in what was becoming tropical San Antone on Nov. 17th and our first hard-freeze, appropriately, on Dec. 7th, and somewhere in between those times ol' Syclone #773 began throwing fits during start-up and for the first 5 or 6 minutes until the water jacket hits and stays at 180? or so. I'm stumped for the first time in a decade or more! Here's what happens: Since the new Walbro fuel-pump went in a few months ago, cranking times are way down... engine catches pretty quick, but now it won't stay lit and "choke" with the new IAC, which went in along with a new TPS and remote-adjustable FPR about a month before the new Walbro. Now, I have to feather the pedal once the ignition gets going and hold the throttle open a bit while the IAC hunts for about a dozen cycles making the tach swing about 1200 rpm back and forth until we hit the "sweet spot" and the engine takes off smoothly and the IAC-hunting stops, at least for a while. Now, it's safe to put her in gear and drive away as long as I keep a little positive bias in the pedal for the next few minutes every time I have to slow down to an idle or coast speed. THIS PROBLEM IS WICKEDLY WORSE ON COLD DAYS, where ambient air is in the 40s or below, which thankfully is rare. (Ain't this global-warming great!) However, on a couple of occasions when I did have to drive in the 30s-- and even after reaching full-warm-up temperature-- the engine starts cutting out seriously as the SES light comes on! Now, we're talking some MAJOR pumping of the pedal to keep things lit and if I can get on a clear piece of road and cruise a spell at 35 mph or better the problem goes away completely, until I shutdown and the engine gets cold again. I barely even recognize that SES light... hardly ever see it. Driving on warmer days never sees a recurrence of that mid-period cutting-out, and idle is smooth as is the rest of drivability. Warm start-ups see a few moments of that IAC-hunting, but the rpm-sweeps are only on the order of 500rpm and the whole anomaly goes away in about 30 seconds. I've NEVER encountered anything like this in my many years of wrenching! Now, it's time for some wretching!! All that ever gets logged in the way of a trouble-code is 44... not too helpful! Naturally, I replaced the O2 sensor-- no improvement at all! Everything described above instinctually told me this was a weird thermal transient in the injector-drive circuits or else the MAT, CTS or MAP I replaced (for the hell of it) 3 years ago needed to be switched again. So I did... one at a time to see if I could fault-locate the culprit that way. No dice! I'm running out of hardware to replace! I've even tried setting that 10-to-1 Chip to different settings, but the same nasty behavior persists-- the engine's as well as my own! WHO CAN TELL ME WHAT MY PROBLEM(S) IS? Be nice, now.... Dennis O. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ Syty mailing list Syty at syty.org http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ Syty mailing list Syty at syty.org http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Syty mailing list Syty at syty.org http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060104/6e1235bb/attachment.html From technowizard at prodigy.net Wed Jan 4 17:05:16 2006 From: technowizard at prodigy.net (Peter) Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2006 15:05:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Syty] What is TV valve lifter rod? In-Reply-To: <005401c6114a$db1c60c0$05f46942@coresys1> Message-ID: <20060104230516.58621.qmail@web80511.mail.yahoo.com> To all who replied, thank you. Please read on--the solution is interesting. The shifting problem was fixed exactly as section 7A1-58 described in the main S-10 manual (not the SyTy supplement). It had nothing to do with the TV cable adjustment or the cable becoming unhooked where it enters the transmission. The manual does not give much detail. As most of you know, the TV cable controls the hydraulic pressure. As I understand it, GM does not want anyone to destroy the tranny by driving with a broken or disconnected TV. The tranny would think the engine was idling and would have such low pressure that it would slip badly. So they have a safety mechanism attached to the TV lever inside the transmission. This is a small rod, maybe 1mm diameter and a ball directly above the TV link pivot point. If the rod is allowed to move too far because the cable is disconnected or broke, the ball blocks the "exhaust" port of the valve, causing full, safe, transmission pressure, even at idle. (Exhaust port is not to be confused with engine exhaust.) That rod had dropped down and was "stuck". If you look directly above the TV pivot and springs you can see the rod and the ball up in a hole. Pull/push it free and push it back up so the ball does not block the port. It is spring loaded and will normally stay there. As a test, if you pivot the linkage too far, you will see the rod fall back down again allowing the ball to move. Why did I get so lucky to be the only one it happened to? At least it was in the manual. Best regards, Peter DOlivares wrote: I don't know about that "exhaust" part, but I've been in enough of those Transmissions to know about that delicate TV-Lifter mechanism, which is actually only "delicate" when you're inside messing with the valve-body or various front-mounted valves/wiring with the pan OFF... jiggling things around the dipstick area. Once you button-up the pan, that S-shape bend at the end of the Bowden-type TV-Cable really cannot work its way out of the li'l hole in the Lifter-Arm's lever, provided you set it up right and adjust the 'Cable properly. Of course, if you never had the pan off in the first place-- and didn't ABUSE the TV-Cable by twisting it or jamming it in-and-out with undue, ape-like force-- you probably don't have to worry about its being disconnected from that Rod-end or the cable breaking. That twisted-steel cable is tough as railroad tie and you really have to WORK to kink it! Breaking or fraying the thing would require TOOLS and deliberate bad intentions. You just need to make sure you have the TV-Cable Bracket properly mounted to the manifold/TB and then do the throttle adjustment of said 'Cable by the book! I have the feeling you're doing the "mashing-down" of the gas pedal part, but you're FAILING to do the CRITICAL MECHANICAL RESET of the 'Cable itself, which is primordial and requires deliberate effort... along with a narrow pair of pliers... needle-nosers come to mind.... Well, did it work? D.O. --------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter To: syty Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2006 2:26 AM Subject: [Syty] What is TV valve lifter rod? Gentlemen, While working on the throttle body last night, I disconnected the TV cable. When I reconnected and took a test drive, the shift points are delayed and extremely hard. Section 7A1-58 of the service manual says something about the "TV valve lifter rod" dropping down to allow the TV exhaust ball to seat if the cable is broken, disconnected, or extremely out of adjustment. I think this is what happened. It then says if the transmission pan is removed, it should be possible to pull down on the TV exhaust valve lifter rod and let the springs return the rod to its normal up position. No pictures or other mention of the TV valve anywhere that I can find. Has this happened to anyone else? If so, any tips on correcting it? Thanks, Peter Albrecht --------------------------------- _______________________________________________ Syty mailing list Syty at syty.org http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060104/c3674b81/attachment.html From zena.thomas at blueyonder.co.uk Sat Jan 7 06:25:39 2006 From: zena.thomas at blueyonder.co.uk (Zena and Vic) Date: Sat, 7 Jan 2006 12:25:39 -0000 Subject: [Syty] loss of power Message-ID: <002f01c61385$78ab7b00$966c2d52@new> hope someone can help. I have a syclone in the uk and when I drive it hard it cuts out in in top gear and then and then fires up again does anybody know why? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060107/6fd5061b/attachment.html From wcalcagno at verizon.net Sat Jan 7 06:54:11 2006 From: wcalcagno at verizon.net (Bill Calcagno) Date: Sat, 07 Jan 2006 07:54:11 -0500 Subject: [Syty] loss of power In-Reply-To: <002f01c61385$78ab7b00$966c2d52@new> References: <002f01c61385$78ab7b00$966c2d52@new> Message-ID: Sounds like you are overboosting. Does the "check engine" light come on for a few seconds when this happens, then go out? If so, that's another confirmation of overboosting. Did you remove or "core" your catalytic converter? If so, the reduced back pressure, combined with the too-small wastegate hole in the stock turbo, is contributing the problem. The problem most commonly shows up when the weather gets cold. The three most common solutions for this are (not in any particular order): use an external wastegate, port the stock wastegate and install a larger valve puck, or get a larger turbo with a larger internal wastegate. You can try adjusting the stock wastegate rod a little longer, but that may not make any difference (depending on how it is currently adjusted). Good Luck, Bill On Jan 7, 2006, at 7:25 AM, Zena and Vic wrote: > hope someone can help. I have a syclone in the uk and when I drive > it hard it cuts out in in top gear and then and then fires up again > does anybody know why? > _______________________________________________ > Syty mailing list > Syty at syty.org > http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty From jdeisenroth at excite.com Mon Jan 9 12:54:43 2006 From: jdeisenroth at excite.com (JOE DEISENROTH) Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2006 13:54:43 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Syty] RE: rear axle problem Message-ID: <20060109185443.D34698A224@xprdmxin.myway.com> Help!!! Upgrading rear brakes on Syclone. The last person to remove the pinion shaft retaining bolt rounded the head somewhat and now I can't get it out. It is not totally rounded, but the edges are just enough not to be able to get the wrench to hold and turn the bolt. I need to remove the axles in order to change the caliper mounting plate. Any ideas? I've tried six point sockets and line wrench without success. Joe Deisenroth Valley Pool & Spa 4741C. E Palm Canyon Dr. PMB 116 Palm Springs, CA 92264 Phone - (760) 778-3939 Fax - (760) 772-5860 www.valleypool-spa.com --- On Wed 10/26, syty-request at syty.org < syty-request at syty.org > wrote: From: syty-request at syty.org [mailto: syty-request at syty.org] To: syty at syty.org Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2005 14:28:44 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Syty Digest, Vol 9, Issue 2 Send Syty mailing list submissions to
syty at syty.org

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Today's Topics:

1. Pulling and replacing the Trans (L1D2B at aol.com)
2. Re: Pulling and replacing the Trans (Brian Hartman)
3. Jeff Nass (Merk1993 at aol.com)
4. M. Kilkenny (Merk1993 at aol.com)
5. Alignment woes (JOE DEISENROTH)
6. Re: Alignment woes (OneGn1Ty at aol.com)
7. RE: Alignment woes (Richard Chan)
8. License plate bulbs (GMCTy at aol.com)
9. Brian Hartman (Routhier, Ron CIV (TRFKB C400))


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Message: 1
Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 23:27:58 EDT
From: L1D2B at aol.com
Subject: [Syty] Pulling and replacing the Trans
To: syty at syty.org, tta-f-body at topica.com, ldbrown at suncor.com,
L1D2B at aol.com
Message-ID: <1fb.12cef13c.307c8b3e at aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Hopefully this will get to the TTA and SyTy lists,

For those who, like me, pretty much have to do all their car work alone - on
pulling and replacing the Transmission :

I have tried to do it w a standard Trans jack. These jacks are too tall, and
U cannot get the trans/jack combo out from under OR, when reinstalling, back
under the car. Not such a big deal when pulling it out because U can just
slide it off the jack and drag it out on the floor. And I'm talking with the
front wheels at least a foot off the ground.

However when reinstalling, it is really hard to lift this 160-180 # monster
onto the jack while on your back under the car. I did it once and about killed
myself - never again.

So when I saw those real low motorcycle jacks, I thought I saw a solution. I
tried it and it works ! U need to get the front wheels ~ 10" off the ground,
but it will slide through the back of the front wheel well. However I needed
to make a sheet steel plate on top of the jack for the trans to rest on
because the platform arms on the jack were wider apart than the bottom of the
trans pan.

If anyone wants pics, I have 2 of them.

Lynn D. Brown
'87 GN, '89 TTA, '93 Typhoon
Denver & SoCal
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Message: 2
Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 21:57:53 -0600 (GMT-06:00)
From: Brian Hartman
Subject: Re: [Syty] Pulling and replacing the Trans
To: L1D2B at aol.com
Cc: syty at syty.org
Message-ID:
<23972691.1129003073973.JavaMail.root at elwamui-little.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

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Message: 3
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2005 09:27:17 EDT
From: Merk1993 at aol.com
Subject: [Syty] Jeff Nass
To: syty at syty.org
Message-ID: <77.4fbf34de.307e6935 at aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

still out there?

Please contact me.

Thanks
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Message: 4
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2005 09:27:42 EDT
From: Merk1993 at aol.com
Subject: [Syty] M. Kilkenny
To: syty at syty.org
Message-ID: <1eb.453d68da.307e694e at aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Still out there?

Please contact me.

THanks
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------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2005 09:40:12 -0400 (EDT)
From: "JOE DEISENROTH"
Subject: [Syty] Alignment woes
To: syty at syty.org
Message-ID: <20051016134012.8C906B6D3 at xprdmailfe15.nwk.excite.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"


"91 Syclone (QWKTWUK)133,000 mls

I go through front tires every 7500 - 10000 miles

Recently changed wheels to ZR1 Corvette style running 275/40/17
Sumitoma tires

3000 miles and I have to change the front tires due to extreme wear (the cords are showing) at the first exterior rib on both front tires

Alignment has been checked often and find no worn parts or bad specs.

1) What is involved in rebuilding the front suspension, any graphite kits avaliable?

2) Could this be caused by a problem w/ the front diff, clutches etc?

Any input is appreciated.


Joe Deisenroth
Valley Pool & Spa
4741C. E Palm Canyon Dr.
PMB 116
Palm Springs, CA 92264
Phone - (760) 778-3939
Fax - (760) 772-5860
www.valleypool-spa.com




------------------------------

Message: 6
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2005 13:56:10 EDT
From: OneGn1Ty at aol.com
Subject: Re: [Syty] Alignment woes
To: JDEISENROTH at excite.com, syty at syty.org
Message-ID: <1d9.470e5f43.3083ee3a at aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Hi,
I used to have similar problems with alignment. Have you tried having a
place that uses the Hunter(I think it's called the Hunter 9000). It does a
roadforce simulation, and can narrow in to get a correct balance. Also many
technicians(if you prefer to call the jacklegs at service centers that) don't cone
our wheels correctly when balancing. I replaced the idler arm, amnd upper and
lower ball joints in mine about a year ago around 130,000mi. That also helped
tremendously. But the Hunter Roadforce balance is the stuff!

Cheryl
'93 Typhoon
'86 GN
http://www.hometown.aol.com/onegn1ty/myhomepageindex.html
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------------------------------

Message: 7
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2005 14:52:15 -0700
From: "Richard Chan"
Subject: RE: [Syty] Alignment woes
To:
Cc: syty at syty.org
Message-ID: <000501c5d29b$e09ee240$c4b0fea9 at astsabre>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

There are two possible reason for outter tire wear, toe and camber.

Inccorrectly adjusted toe can wear out a tire in as little as 5000 to
7500 miles on the outter edge of tire. Check the Sy/Ty website for
specs. You want a before and after alignment printout.

Toe is usually correct by adjusting the sleeves that connect the inner
and outer tie rods on each side of the centre link. Before adjusting I
would check the idler arm and the rest of the suspension parts for any
loose or worn parts.

Camber on Sy/Ty are adjust by turning the nuts and bolt that pass
through and offset washer in the upper control arm bushings. I would
check the upper control arm bushing for wear from the excess heat of the
engine before replacing any ball joints. Energy suspension makes upper
and lower control arm bushings.

-----Original Message-----
From: syty-bounces at syty.org [mailto:syty-bounces at syty.org] On Behalf Of
JOE DEISENROTH
Sent: October 16, 2005 6:40 AM
To: syty at syty.org
Subject: [Syty] Alignment woes



"91 Syclone (QWKTWUK)133,000 mls

I go through front tires every 7500 - 10000 miles

Recently changed wheels to ZR1 Corvette style running 275/40/17 Sumitoma
tires

3000 miles and I have to change the front tires due to extreme wear (the
cords are showing) at the first exterior rib on both front tires

Alignment has been checked often and find no worn parts or bad specs.

1) What is involved in rebuilding the front suspension, any graphite
kits avaliable?

2) Could this be caused by a problem w/ the front diff, clutches etc?

Any input is appreciated.


Joe Deisenroth
Valley Pool & Spa
4741C. E Palm Canyon Dr.
PMB 116
Palm Springs, CA 92264
Phone - (760) 778-3939
Fax - (760) 772-5860
www.valleypool-spa.com


_______________________________________________
Syty mailing list
Syty at syty.org
http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty



------------------------------

Message: 8
Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2005 22:09:07 EDT
From: GMCTy at aol.com
Subject: [Syty] License plate bulbs
To: syty at syty.org
Message-ID: <1e9.46e14702.3089a7c3 at aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Stupid question. How do you remove the holder for the bulb. Does it twist
off or do you pry it which i don't want to do.
Howie
93 Ty
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------------------------------

Message: 9
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2005 14:26:09 -0400
From: "Routhier, Ron CIV (TRFKB C400)"
Subject: [Syty] Brian Hartman
To: "'syty at syty.org'"
Message-ID:
<2B9F40DB39EBD51181A600034773CA59072C3F0C at trfkba652a01.trfkb.navy.mil>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

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------------------------------

_______________________________________________
Syty mailing list
Syty at syty.org
http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty


End of Syty Digest, Vol 9, Issue 2
**********************************
From seravilo at netzero.net Mon Jan 9 13:22:55 2006 From: seravilo at netzero.net (DOlivares) Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2006 13:22:55 -0600 Subject: [Syty] RE: rear axle problem References: <20060109185443.D34698A224@xprdmxin.myway.com> Message-ID: <000f01c61552$18c0d4f0$02f46942@coresys1> I'd soak the pinion nut in Kroil or Sili-Kroil for an hour or so (applied in 3 separate sprayings) after which-- based on my experience with that wonder-oil-- you might damn well be able to twist it off with your bare hand! Well, almost.... I'd also be using one of those "unisex" sockets which cam-grip fasteners from their shoulders and hence work on comparably sized metrics or SAEs. Harbor Freight/Pittsburg sells a good set of these for less than $30, last I checked, and in impact-grade to boot! Failing to get Dual-fit Socket, you can further grind down the corners of the Nut... just enough so you can HAMMER-ON the next-smallest socket you have, SAE or Metric. At that point, you will not get any further rounding-off and can proceed with a mega-breaker-bar or, preferably, a Joe-Frazier-grade IMPACT WRENCH! Be sure you go and get a new Nut from GM or generic gear-purveyor before you wreck your old one, needless to say. As an aside, I can accept your need to remove the Axles so you can get on those new backing plates and parking-brake rigging, but I know at least I could do so WITHOUT having to remove the pinion, which is gonna cause you a lot of grief for no reason short of swapping-in a new posi, bearings or ring and/or pinion-- same 3.42 ration of course... otherwise you'll "sugar" your Transaxle.... WHY are you so fixated on that Nut? Good luck in any event, D.O. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: JOE DEISENROTH To: syty at syty.org Sent: Monday, January 09, 2006 12:54 PM Subject: [Syty] RE: rear axle problem Help!!! Upgrading rear brakes on Syclone. The last person to remove the pinion shaft retaining bolt rounded the head somewhat and now I can't get it out. It is not totally rounded, but the edges are just enough not to be able to get the wrench to hold and turn the bolt. I need to remove the axles in order to change the caliper mounting plate. Any ideas? I've tried six point sockets and line wrench without success. Joe Deisenroth Valley Pool & Spa 4741C. E Palm Canyon Dr. PMB 116 Palm Springs, CA 92264 Phone - (760) 778-3939 Fax - (760) 772-5860 www.valleypool-spa.com --- On Wed 10/26, syty-request at syty.org < syty-request at syty.org > wrote: From: syty-request at syty.org [mailto: syty-request at syty.org] To: syty at syty.org Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2005 14:28:44 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Syty Digest, Vol 9, Issue 2 Send Syty mailing list submissions to
syty at syty.org

To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
syty-request at syty.org

You can reach the person managing the list at
syty-owner at syty.org

When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Syty digest..."


Today's Topics:

1. Pulling and replacing the Trans (L1D2B at aol.com)
2. Re: Pulling and replacing the Trans (Brian Hartman)
3. Jeff Nass (Merk1993 at aol.com)
4. M. Kilkenny (Merk1993 at aol.com)
5. Alignment woes (JOE DEISENROTH)
6. Re: Alignment woes (OneGn1Ty at aol.com)
7. RE: Alignment woes (Richard Chan)
8. License plate bulbs (GMCTy at aol.com)
9. Brian Hartman (Routhier, Ron CIV (TRFKB C400))


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 23:27:58 EDT
From: L1D2B at aol.com
Subject: [Syty] Pulling and replacing the Trans
To: syty at syty.org, tta-f-body at topica.com, ldbrown at suncor.com,
L1D2B at aol.com
Message-ID: <1fb.12cef13c.307c8b3e at aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Hopefully this will get to the TTA and SyTy lists,

For those who, like me, pretty much have to do all their car work alone - on
pulling and replacing the Transmission :

I have tried to do it w a standard Trans jack. These jacks are too tall, and
U cannot get the trans/jack combo out from under OR, when reinstalling, back
under the car. Not such a big deal when pulling it out because U can just
slide it off the jack and drag it out on the floor. And I'm talking with the
front wheels at least a foot off the ground.

However when reinstalling, it is really hard to lift this 160-180 # monster
onto the jack while on your back under the car. I did it once and about killed
myself - never again.

So when I saw those real low motorcycle jacks, I thought I saw a solution. I
tried it and it works ! U need to get the front wheels ~ 10" off the ground,
but it will slide through the back of the front wheel well. However I needed
to make a sheet steel plate on top of the jack for the trans to rest on
because the platform arms on the jack were wider apart than the bottom of the
trans pan.

If anyone wants pics, I have 2 of them.

Lynn D. Brown
'87 GN, '89 TTA, '93 Typhoon
Denver & SoCal
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Message: 2
Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 21:57:53 -0600 (GMT-06:00)
From: Brian Hartman
Subject: Re: [Syty] Pulling and replacing the Trans
To: L1D2B at aol.com
Cc: syty at syty.org
Message-ID:
<23972691.1129003073973.JavaMail.root at elwamui-little.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

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------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2005 09:27:17 EDT
From: Merk1993 at aol.com
Subject: [Syty] Jeff Nass
To: syty at syty.org
Message-ID: <77.4fbf34de.307e6935 at aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

still out there?

Please contact me.

Thanks
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------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2005 09:27:42 EDT
From: Merk1993 at aol.com
Subject: [Syty] M. Kilkenny
To: syty at syty.org
Message-ID: <1eb.453d68da.307e694e at aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Still out there?

Please contact me.

THanks
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------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2005 09:40:12 -0400 (EDT)
From: "JOE DEISENROTH"
Subject: [Syty] Alignment woes
To: syty at syty.org
Message-ID: <20051016134012.8C906B6D3 at xprdmailfe15.nwk.excite.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"


"91 Syclone (QWKTWUK)133,000 mls

I go through front tires every 7500 - 10000 miles

Recently changed wheels to ZR1 Corvette style running 275/40/17
Sumitoma tires

3000 miles and I have to change the front tires due to extreme wear (the cords are showing) at the first exterior rib on both front tires

Alignment has been checked often and find no worn parts or bad specs.

1) What is involved in rebuilding the front suspension, any graphite kits avaliable?

2) Could this be caused by a problem w/ the front diff, clutches etc?

Any input is appreciated.


Joe Deisenroth
Valley Pool & Spa
4741C. E Palm Canyon Dr.
PMB 116
Palm Springs, CA 92264
Phone - (760) 778-3939
Fax - (760) 772-5860
www.valleypool-spa.com




------------------------------

Message: 6
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2005 13:56:10 EDT
From: OneGn1Ty at aol.com
Subject: Re: [Syty] Alignment woes
To: JDEISENROTH at excite.com, syty at syty.org
Message-ID: <1d9.470e5f43.3083ee3a at aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Hi,
I used to have similar problems with alignment. Have you tried having a
place that uses the Hunter(I think it's called the Hunter 9000). It does a
roadforce simulation, and can narrow in to get a correct balance. Also many
technicians(if you prefer to call the jacklegs at service centers that) don't cone
our wheels correctly when balancing. I replaced the idler arm, amnd upper and
lower ball joints in mine about a year ago around 130,000mi. That also helped
tremendously. But the Hunter Roadforce balance is the stuff!

Cheryl
'93 Typhoon
'86 GN
http://www.hometown.aol.com/onegn1ty/myhomepageindex.html
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------------------------------

Message: 7
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2005 14:52:15 -0700
From: "Richard Chan"
Subject: RE: [Syty] Alignment woes
To:
Cc: syty at syty.org
Message-ID: <000501c5d29b$e09ee240$c4b0fea9 at astsabre>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

There are two possible reason for outter tire wear, toe and camber.

Inccorrectly adjusted toe can wear out a tire in as little as 5000 to
7500 miles on the outter edge of tire. Check the Sy/Ty website for
specs. You want a before and after alignment printout.

Toe is usually correct by adjusting the sleeves that connect the inner
and outer tie rods on each side of the centre link. Before adjusting I
would check the idler arm and the rest of the suspension parts for any
loose or worn parts.

Camber on Sy/Ty are adjust by turning the nuts and bolt that pass
through and offset washer in the upper control arm bushings. I would
check the upper control arm bushing for wear from the excess heat of the
engine before replacing any ball joints. Energy suspension makes upper
and lower control arm bushings.

-----Original Message-----
From: syty-bounces at syty.org [mailto:syty-bounces at syty.org] On Behalf Of
JOE DEISENROTH
Sent: October 16, 2005 6:40 AM
To: syty at syty.org
Subject: [Syty] Alignment woes



"91 Syclone (QWKTWUK)133,000 mls

I go through front tires every 7500 - 10000 miles

Recently changed wheels to ZR1 Corvette style running 275/40/17 Sumitoma
tires

3000 miles and I have to change the front tires due to extreme wear (the
cords are showing) at the first exterior rib on both front tires

Alignment has been checked often and find no worn parts or bad specs.

1) What is involved in rebuilding the front suspension, any graphite
kits avaliable?

2) Could this be caused by a problem w/ the front diff, clutches etc?

Any input is appreciated.


Joe Deisenroth
Valley Pool & Spa
4741C. E Palm Canyon Dr.
PMB 116
Palm Springs, CA 92264
Phone - (760) 778-3939
Fax - (760) 772-5860
www.valleypool-spa.com


_______________________________________________
Syty mailing list
Syty at syty.org
http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty



------------------------------

Message: 8
Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2005 22:09:07 EDT
From: GMCTy at aol.com
Subject: [Syty] License plate bulbs
To: syty at syty.org
Message-ID: <1e9.46e14702.3089a7c3 at aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Stupid question. How do you remove the holder for the bulb. Does it twist
off or do you pry it which i don't want to do.
Howie
93 Ty
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------------------------------

Message: 9
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2005 14:26:09 -0400
From: "Routhier, Ron CIV (TRFKB C400)"
Subject: [Syty] Brian Hartman
To: "'syty at syty.org'"
Message-ID:
<2B9F40DB39EBD51181A600034773CA59072C3F0C at trfkba652a01.trfkb.navy.mil>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

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------------------------------

_______________________________________________
Syty mailing list
Syty at syty.org
http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty


End of Syty Digest, Vol 9, Issue 2
**********************************
_______________________________________________ Syty mailing list Syty at syty.org http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060109/32bafa8c/attachment.html From rebel_racer_ta at yahoo.com Tue Jan 10 21:51:47 2006 From: rebel_racer_ta at yahoo.com (W M) Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2006 19:51:47 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Syty] RE: rear axle problem In-Reply-To: <20060109185443.D34698A224@xprdmxin.myway.com> Message-ID: <20060111035147.66848.qmail@web35501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Joe, They have some specialized sockets for getting out rounded bolts at Sears. Here is a link to it: http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/product.do?BV_UseBVCookie=Yes&vertical=TOOL&pid=00952161000 or just go to sears.com and search the tools section for a Craftsman Bolt-Out??? Damaged Bolt/Nut Remover Set. Hope this helps. Will --- JOE DEISENROTH wrote: > > > Help!!! > > Upgrading rear brakes on Syclone. > > The last person to remove the pinion shaft retaining > bolt rounded the head somewhat and now I can't get > it out. It is not totally rounded, but the edges are > just enough not to be able to get the wrench to hold > and turn the bolt. > > I need to remove the axles in order to change the > caliper mounting plate. > > Any ideas? > > I've tried six point sockets and line wrench without > success. > > Joe Deisenroth > Valley Pool & Spa > 4741C. E Palm Canyon Dr. > PMB 116 > Palm Springs, CA 92264 > Phone - (760) 778-3939 > Fax - (760) 772-5860 > www.valleypool-spa.com > > --- On Wed 10/26, syty-request at syty.org < > syty-request at syty.org > wrote: > From: syty-request at syty.org [mailto: > syty-request at syty.org] > To: syty at syty.org > Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2005 14:28:44 -0400 (EDT) > Subject: Syty Digest, Vol 9, Issue 2 > > Send Syty mailing list submissions to
> syty at syty.org

To subscribe or unsubscribe via > the World Wide Web, visit
> http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty
or, > via email, send a message with subject or body > 'help' to
syty-request at syty.org

You can > reach the person managing the list at
> syty-owner at syty.org

When replying, please > edit your Subject line so it is more > specific
than "Re: Contents of Syty > digest..."


Today's Topics:

1. > Pulling and replacing the Trans (L1D2B at aol.com)
> 2. Re: Pulling and replacing the Trans (Brian > Hartman)
3. Jeff Nass (Merk1993 at aol.com)
> 4. M. Kilkenny (Merk1993 at aol.com)
5. Alignment > woes (JOE DEISENROTH)
6. Re: Alignment woes > (OneGn1Ty at aol.com)
7. RE: Alignment woes > (Richard Chan)
8. License plate bulbs > (GMCTy at aol.com)
9. Brian Hartman (Routhier, > Ron CIV (TRFKB > C400))


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: > 1
Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 23:27:58 EDT
From: > L1D2B at aol.com
Subject: [Syty] Pulling and > replacing the Trans
To: syty at syty.org, > tta-f-body at topica.com, ldbrown at suncor.com,
> L1D2B at aol.com
Message-ID: > <1fb.12cef13c.307c8b3e at aol.com>
Content-Type: > text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Hopefully this > will get to the TTA and SyTy lists,

For > those who, like me, pretty much have to do all their > car work alone - on
pulling and replacing the > Transmission :

I have tried to do it w a > standard Trans jack. These jacks are too tall, and >
U cannot get the trans/jack combo out from under > OR, when reinstalling, back
under the car. Not > such a big deal when pulling it out because U can > just
slide it off the jack and drag it out on > the floor. And I'm talking with the
front > wheels at least a foot off the ground.
>
However when > reinstalling, it is really hard to lift this 160-180 > # monster
onto the jack while on your back > under the car. I did it once and about killed
> myself - never again.

So when I saw those > real low motorcycle jacks, I thought I saw a > solution. I
tried it and it works ! U need to > get the front wheels ~ 10" off the ground,
but > it will slide through the back of the front wheel > well. However I needed
to make a sheet steel > plate on top of the jack for the trans to rest on >
because the platform arms on the jack were wider > apart than the bottom of the
trans pan.
>
If anyone wants pics, I have 2 of them.
>
Lynn D. Brown
'87 GN, '89 TTA, '93 > Typhoon
Denver & SoCal
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------------------------------

Message: > 2
Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 21:57:53 > -0600 (GMT-06:00)
From: Brian Hartman >
Subject: Re: [Syty] > Pulling and replacing the Trans
To: > L1D2B at aol.com
Cc: > syty at syty.org
Message-ID:
> <23972691.1129003073973.JavaMail.root at elwamui-little.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
>
Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="us-ascii"

An HTML attachment was > scrubbed...
URL: > http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20051010/d5a9df3c/attachment-0001.html

------------------------------

Message: > 3
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2005 09:27:17 EDT
From: > Merk1993 at aol.com
Subject: [Syty] Jeff Nass
To: > syty at syty.org
Message-ID: > <77.4fbf34de.307e6935 at aol.com>
Content-Type: > text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

still out > there?

Please contact > me.

Thanks
-------------- next part > --------------
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------------------------------

Message: > 4
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2005 09:27:42 EDT
From: > Merk1993 at aol.com
Subject: [Syty] M. > Kilkenny
To: syty at syty.org
Message-ID: > <1eb.453d68da.307e694e at aol.com>
Content-Type: > text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Still out > there?

Please contact > me.

THanks
-------------- next part > --------------
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------------------------------

Message: > 5
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2005 09:40:12 -0400 > (EDT)
From: "JOE DEISENROTH" >
Subject: [Syty] > Alignment woes
To: syty at syty.org
Message-ID: > <20051016134012.8C906B6D3 at xprdmailfe15.nwk.excite.com>
Content-Type: > text/plain; charset="us-ascii"


"91 > Syclone (QWKTWUK)133,000 mls

I go through > front tires every 7500 - 10000 miles

Recently > changed wheels to ZR1 Corvette style running > 275/40/17
Sumitoma tires

3000 miles and I > have to change the front tires due to extreme wear > (the cords are showing) at the first exterior rib on > both front tires

Alignment has been checked > often and find no worn parts or bad specs.

1) > What is involved in rebuilding the front suspension, > any graphite kits avaliable?

2) Could this be > caused by a problem w/ the front diff, clutches > etc?

Any input is appreciated.


Joe > Deisenroth
Valley Pool & Spa
4741C. E Palm > Canyon Dr.
PMB 116
Palm Springs, CA > 92264
Phone - (760) 778-3939
Fax - (760) > 772-5860
www.valleypool-spa.com




------------------------------

Message: > 6
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2005 13:56:10 EDT
From: > OneGn1Ty at aol.com
Subject: Re: [Syty] Alignment > woes
To: JDEISENROTH at excite.com, > syty at syty.org
Message-ID: > <1d9.470e5f43.3083ee3a at aol.com>
Content-Type: > text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Hi,
I used > to have similar problems with alignment. Have you > tried having a
place that uses the Hunter(I > think it's called the Hunter 9000). It does a >
roadforce simulation, and can narrow in to get a > correct balance. Also many
technicians(if you > prefer to call the jacklegs at service centers that) > don't cone
our wheels correctly when balancing. > I replaced the idler arm, amnd upper and
lower > ball joints in mine about a year ago around > 130,000mi. That also helped
tremendously. But > the Hunter Roadforce balance is the stuff!
>
Cheryl
'93 Typhoon
'86 > GN
http://www.hometown.aol.com/onegn1ty/myhomepageindex.html
-------------- > next part --------------
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Message: > > 7
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2005 14:52:15 -0700
From: > "Richard Chan"
Subject: RE: > [Syty] Alignment woes
To: >
Cc: > syty at syty.org
Message-ID: > <000501c5d29b$e09ee240$c4b0fea9 at astsabre>
Content-Type: > text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"

There are > two possible reason for outter tire wear, toe and > camber.

Inccorrectly adjusted toe can wear > out a tire in as little as 5000 to
7500 miles on > the outter edge of tire. Check the Sy/Ty website > for
specs. You want a before and after alignment > printout.

Toe is usually correct by adjusting > the sleeves that connect the inner
and outer tie > rods on each side of the centre link. Before > adjusting I
would check the idler arm and the > rest of the suspension parts for any
loose or > worn parts.

Camber on Sy/Ty are adjust by > turning the nuts and bolt that pass
through and > offset washer in the upper control arm bushings. I > would
check the upper > control arm bushing for wear from the excess heat of > the
engine before replacing any ball joints. > Energy suspension makes upper
and lower control > arm bushings.

-----Original > Message-----
From: syty-bounces at syty.org > [mailto:syty-bounces at syty.org] On Behalf Of
JOE > DEISENROTH
Sent: October 16, 2005 6:40 AM
To: > syty at syty.org
Subject: [Syty] Alignment > woes



"91 Syclone (QWKTWUK)133,000 > mls

I === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From technowizard at prodigy.net Sat Jan 14 09:34:43 2006 From: technowizard at prodigy.net (Peter) Date: Sat, 14 Jan 2006 07:34:43 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Syty] Passed emissions test, but why? Message-ID: <20060114153443.7273.qmail@web80515.mail.scd.yahoo.com> Why does thermostat temperature have so large an influence on passing emissions? Twice now my Ty has failed emissions testing here in St. Louis, just barely failing HC, NOx, and CO. The third attempt followed swapping the 160F thermostat for a 195F thermostat. It "quick passed" with emissions at about 10% of the allowable limit. Exact same story as the last test two years ago. I presume the catalytic converter was not firing up with the 160F and came alive with the 195. So why does the thermostat influence exhaust gas temperature so much? Or is there another emissions control mechanism at work? Best regards, Peter -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060114/5ad0fc7a/attachment.html From seravilo at netzero.net Sat Jan 14 15:35:20 2006 From: seravilo at netzero.net (DOlivares) Date: Sat, 14 Jan 2006 15:35:20 -0600 Subject: [Syty] Passed emissions test, but why? References: <20060114153443.7273.qmail@web80515.mail.scd.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <004001c61952$6cb4aab0$619d5841@coresys1> It's "basic" thermodynamics! The HOTTER the cylinder-inlet temperature of the (hopefully) oxygen-rich air and gasoline mist, the higher will be the peak cylinder pressure/temperature after combustion. Hotter inlet-fuel/air temperature, i.e., "initial conditions" from your ol' physics days, is the near-exclusive function of cylinder-wall/head-temps and thus the hotter thermostat you run the better your emissions (and gas mileage) up to the point where the safety/reliability/drivability algorithms in your ECM will start backing-out ignition-advance, enrich the mixture (injectors' pulse-width) or whatever to prevent piston-meltdown, radical preignition or some other illusory fatality that almost never happens if you've kept your motor in good shape and done your build-up homework correctly. The trade-off for "running hot" goes beyond simply trying to outfox your onboard computer (which is why I got into chip-reprogramming years ago...) and includes dealing with harsh realities. For example, running high underhood temps will degrade your plastics and rubbers (!) at an accelerated rate, especially after hard-run summer heat-soaks without a hood-scoop for venting. (On the other hand, you can roast weenies-- even your own if you're not careful-- with that car-heater set on High!) Elevated intake-manifold/filter/pipe temperatures also tend to offset all that nice, cold, oxygen-dense air you went through all that trouble to ram-in from outside that hostile underhood environment-- not optimal for peak-power production and racing. High-heat/lean-burn conditions also drives up NOx emissions, which used to be a don't-care (and which is why I got away with so many emisso-tricks in Virginia years ago!) but may now place a hard-limit on how low you want to drive your CO and unburned-HC readings in "sensitive" jurisdictions such as yours appears to be.... This topic is quite a bit more complex than I'm letting on, but you got your basic answer, I hope. Even I could find fault with nearly everything I said above, depending on context and circumstances! But then, I like arguing with myself best of all... helps keep me young at heart. And now that I've pulled the pin, let's see what colorful responses (and the usual personal attacks... from the usual Peanut Gallery) this Grenade provokes! I can almost predict what I'll see.... Your Faithful Servant -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter To: syty Sent: Saturday, January 14, 2006 9:34 AM Subject: [Syty] Passed emissions test, but why? Why does thermostat temperature have so large an influence on passing emissions? Twice now my Ty has failed emissions testing here in St. Louis, just barely failing HC, NOx, and CO. The third attempt followed swapping the 160F thermostat for a 195F thermostat. It "quick passed" with emissions at about 10% of the allowable limit. Exact same story as the last test two years ago. I presume the catalytic converter was not firing up with the 160F and came alive with the 195. So why does the thermostat influence exhaust gas temperature so much? Or is there another emissions control mechanism at work? Best regards, Peter -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- _______________________________________________ Syty mailing list Syty at syty.org http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060114/60f271f9/attachment.html From technowizard at prodigy.net Sat Jan 14 19:14:36 2006 From: technowizard at prodigy.net (Peter) Date: Sat, 14 Jan 2006 17:14:36 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Syty] Passed emissions test, but why? In-Reply-To: <004001c61952$6cb4aab0$619d5841@coresys1> Message-ID: <20060115011436.20039.qmail@web80503.mail.yahoo.com> Dennis, Thanks for the insight. I think few readers will disagree with anything you've said. Since I don't have a hood scoop, I do like the 160F thermostat for keeping things just a bit cooler under the hood for the general benefit of the components as well as performance. If I do ever get a vented hood, I would look for one with the opening at the front instead of at the windshield, since the windshield is a high pressure area and actually flows in the reverse direction when at speed. One person responded with the possibility that at 160F, the engine might think it is not fully warmed up and will deliberately idle rich. He mentioned that normally we assume a rich mxiture would make the converter run hotter. I'm not sure that applies at idle. I have heard of engine controls programmed to intentionally run extra fuel to cool the converter during extended idle longer than 45 seconds. Where I read this, they mentioned the emissions test will pass the idle portion if either the idle at the beginning or at the end of the test pass. Sometimes the idle at the beginning will be screwed up by the extended idling in line. Unless you know enough to idle at 1500 to 2000 rpm while waiting for your turn on the treadmill. Then hope they don't take too long testing the gas cap. Anyway, do you think the rich idle theory could be a plausible component of the 160/195F emissions delta? Peter DOlivares wrote: It's "basic" thermodynamics! The HOTTER the cylinder-inlet temperature of the (hopefully) oxygen-rich air and gasoline mist, the higher will be the peak cylinder pressure/temperature after combustion. Hotter inlet-fuel/air temperature, i.e., "initial conditions" from your ol' physics days, is the near-exclusive function of cylinder-wall/head-temps and thus the hotter thermostat you run the better your emissions (and gas mileage) up to the point where the safety/reliability/drivability algorithms in your ECM will start backing-out ignition-advance, enrich the mixture (injectors' pulse-width) or whatever to prevent piston-meltdown, radical preignition or some other illusory fatality that almost never happens if you've kept your motor in good shape and done your build-up homework correctly. The trade-off for "running hot" goes beyond simply trying to outfox your onboard computer (which is why I got into chip-reprogramming years ago...) and includes dealing with harsh realities. For example, running high underhood temps will degrade your plastics and rubbers (!) at an accelerated rate, especially after hard-run summer heat-soaks without a hood-scoop for venting. (On the other hand, you can roast weenies-- even your own if you're not careful-- with that car-heater set on High!) Elevated intake-manifold/filter/pipe temperatures also tend to offset all that nice, cold, oxygen-dense air you went through all that trouble to ram-in from outside that hostile underhood environment-- not optimal for peak-power production and racing. High-heat/lean-burn conditions also drives up NOx emissions, which used to be a don't-care (and which is why I got away with so many emisso-tricks in Virginia years ago!) but may now place a hard-limit on how low you want to drive your CO and unburned-HC readings in "sensitive" jurisdictions such as yours appears to be.... This topic is quite a bit more complex than I'm letting on, but you got your basic answer, I hope. Even I could find fault with nearly everything I said above, depending on context and circumstances! But then, I like arguing with myself best of all... helps keep me young at heart. And now that I've pulled the pin, let's see what colorful responses (and the usual personal attacks... from the usual Peanut Gallery) this Grenade provokes! I can almost predict what I'll see.... Your Faithful Servant --------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter To: syty Sent: Saturday, January 14, 2006 9:34 AM Subject: [Syty] Passed emissions test, but why? Why does thermostat temperature have so large an influence on passing emissions? Twice now my Ty has failed emissions testing here in St. Louis, just barely failing HC, NOx, and CO. The third attempt followed swapping the 160F thermostat for a 195F thermostat. It "quick passed" with emissions at about 10% of the allowable limit. Exact same story as the last test two years ago. I presume the catalytic converter was not firing up with the 160F and came alive with the 195. So why does the thermostat influence exhaust gas temperature so much? Or is there another emissions control mechanism at work? Best regards, Peter --------------------------------- _______________________________________________ Syty mailing list Syty at syty.org http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060114/f0a7c479/attachment.html From seravilo at netzero.net Wed Jan 18 12:21:37 2006 From: seravilo at netzero.net (DOlivares) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 2006 12:21:37 -0600 Subject: [Syty] Passed emissions test, but why? References: <20060115011436.20039.qmail@web80503.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <003f01c61c5c$06319700$11f46942@coresys1> Sorry about the delay, I've just been hit by a dozen alligators all at once. Hot-rodding has gone to the back-back burner. I'm less familiar with the SyTy than the Grand National/TTA ECM, but every cold engine needs to go through some sort of "choke cycle" before it gets sufficiently warmed-up to go into lean-burn, CLOSED-LOOP operation. So if you were to be parked overnight at your local tailpipe-sniffer's... in hopes of being first in line the next morning... and then started up and pulled right into the inspection station, YOUR CAR WOULD FLUNK at least unburned-HC in a big, big way! And the colder the outside air-temp, the worse your "F" would be and the longer the interval to get into closed loop. The TTA's algorithm for this "choke sequence" is such that running a 160? t-stat in winter conditions (IAT reading correlated with CTS) could delay closed loop indefinitely. Chip-reprogramming or soldering 300? switched-resistors into the harness was the only way around this as I recall, but unfortunately all my priceless TTA notes have been either mislaid or stolen in my mega-move from Maryland, and my own senility has warped the rest of my memory of midnight surgeries performed over a decade ago.... I haven't read about this extended-choke problem with 160? t-stats in our particular vehicles so I can only assume the fuel-enrichment algorithm is different. JIM SLOAN should be able to tell us about this from a position of superior experience, I told. I've never even gotten around to swapping my 180? thermostat in the Syclone (which doesn't "ping" in any case and won't "choke" properly at all these cooler days... as you've likely been reading lately) and I haven't driven the Radar-Blue 'Phoon enough to observe rich-running problems or flunking emissions. We don't have such tyranny in Texas! ...at least not in San Antonio! So as usual, the answer to your question remains: "It depends...." Mr. Wizard -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter To: DOlivares ; syty Sent: Saturday, January 14, 2006 7:14 PM Subject: Re: [Syty] Passed emissions test, but why? Dennis, Thanks for the insight. I think few readers will disagree with anything you've said. Since I don't have a hood scoop, I do like the 160F thermostat for keeping things just a bit cooler under the hood for the general benefit of the components as well as performance. If I do ever get a vented hood, I would look for one with the opening at the front instead of at the windshield, since the windshield is a high pressure area and actually flows in the reverse direction when at speed. One person responded with the possibility that at 160F, the engine might think it is not fully warmed up and will deliberately idle rich. He mentioned that normally we assume a rich mxiture would make the converter run hotter. I'm not sure that applies at idle. I have heard of engine controls programmed to intentionally run extra fuel to cool the converter during extended idle longer than 45 seconds. Where I read this, they mentioned the emissions test will pass the idle portion if either the idle at the beginning or at the end of the test pass. Sometimes the idle at the beginning will be screwed up by the extended idling in line. Unless you know enough to idle at 1500 to 2000 rpm while waiting for your turn on the treadmill. Then hope they don't take too long testing the gas cap. Anyway, do you think the rich idle theory could be a plausible component of the 160/195F emissions delta? Peter DOlivares wrote: It's "basic" thermodynamics! The HOTTER the cylinder-inlet temperature of the (hopefully) oxygen-rich air and gasoline mist, the higher will be the peak cylinder pressure/temperature after combustion. Hotter inlet-fuel/air temperature, i.e., "initial conditions" from your ol' physics days, is the near-exclusive function of cylinder-wall/head-temps and thus the hotter thermostat you run the better your emissions (and gas mileage) up to the point where the safety/reliability/drivability algorithms in your ECM will start backing-out ignition-advance, enrich the mixture (injectors' pulse-width) or whatever to prevent piston-meltdown, radical preignition or some other illusory fatality that almost never happens if you've kept your motor in good shape and done your build-up homework correctly. The trade-off for "running hot" goes beyond simply trying to outfox your onboard computer (which is why I got into chip-reprogramming years ago...) and includes dealing with harsh realities. For example, running high underhood temps will degrade your plastics and rubbers (!) at an accelerated rate, especially after hard-run summer heat-soaks without a hood-scoop for venting. (On the other hand, you can roast weenies-- even your own if you're not careful-- with that car-heater set on High!) Elevated intake-manifold/filter/pipe temperatures also tend to offset all that nice, cold, oxygen-dense air you went through all that trouble to ram-in from outside that hostile underhood environment-- not optimal for peak-power production and racing. High-heat/lean-burn conditions also drives up NOx emissions, which used to be a don't-care (and which is why I got away with so many emisso-tricks in Virginia years ago!) but may now place a hard-limit on how low you want to drive your CO and unburned-HC readings in "sensitive" jurisdictions such as yours appears to be.... This topic is quite a bit more complex than I'm letting on, but you got your basic answer, I hope. Even I could find fault with nearly everything I said above, depending on context and circumstances! But then, I like arguing with myself best of all... helps keep me young at heart. And now that I've pulled the pin, let's see what colorful responses (and the usual personal attacks... from the usual Peanut Gallery) this Grenade provokes! I can almost predict what I'll see.... Your Faithful Servant ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ----- Original Message ----- From: Peter To: syty Sent: Saturday, January 14, 2006 9:34 AM Subject: [Syty] Passed emissions test, but why? Why does thermostat temperature have so large an influence on passing emissions? Twice now my Ty has failed emissions testing here in St. Louis, just barely failing HC, NOx, and CO. The third attempt followed swapping the 160F thermostat for a 195F thermostat. It "quick passed" with emissions at about 10% of the allowable limit. Exact same story as the last test two years ago. I presume the catalytic converter was not firing up with the 160F and came alive with the 195. So why does the thermostat influence exhaust gas temperature so much? Or is there another emissions control mechanism at work? Best regards, Peter ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Syty mailing list Syty at syty.org http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060118/7eed02c9/attachment.html From RadarBlueTyphoon at aol.com Wed Jan 18 20:04:53 2006 From: RadarBlueTyphoon at aol.com (RadarBlueTyphoon at aol.com) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 2006 21:04:53 EST Subject: [Syty] Passed emissions test, but why? Message-ID: <12b.6c90e79c.31004dc5@aol.com> Well Dennis maybe you can explain this one for him. The Ty you purchased from me has run an 160 thermostat since I purchased it and it never failed an emission test her in St. Louis. Tim -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060118/82f8a804/attachment.html From seravilo at netzero.net Wed Jan 18 21:24:07 2006 From: seravilo at netzero.net (DOlivares) Date: Wed, 18 Jan 2006 21:24:07 -0600 Subject: [Syty] Passed emissions test, but why? References: <87.368b0064.31004d9a@aol.com> Message-ID: <001501c61ca7$cfc68d50$24f46942@coresys1> It's obviously 'cause, as I plainly said, the ECM algorithms of the SyTys apparently don't correlate IAT & CTS inputs in such a way as to prevent the System from going into closed-loop operation... probably after a fixed amount of TIME or other variable. I "explain" it by the absence of commentary or notices to the contrary. And even though you may have passed emissions-- possibly with a "gentlemen's C"-- with that colder-than-stock unit, I think you might well have ace'd the test with a hotter 'stat! Never having HAD to worry about emissions blues with either my 'Phoon or my 'Clone (which also came with a 160? t-stat but which I changed to a 180? right away as part of the underdrive-pulley installation... to facilitate drivability, increase the lousy mileage, and keep my tootsies warm in that Northern climate), I just never got into the finagling I did with the TTA. Then I leapfrogged to the 10-in-1 a year later and left my SyTy-chip-reprogramming activities on the Bench for a rainy day.... Okay? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: RadarBlueTyphoon at aol.com To: seravilo at netzero.net Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2006 8:04 PM Subject: Re: [Syty] Passed emissions test, but why? Well Dennis maybe you can explain this one for him. The Ty you purchased from me has run an 160 thermostat since I purchased it and it never failed an emission test her in St. Louis. Tim -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060118/b1c81f1d/attachment.html From leroy at sunflower.com Thu Jan 19 07:02:21 2006 From: leroy at sunflower.com (Jim Sloan) Date: Thu, 19 Jan 2006 07:02:21 -0600 Subject: [Syty] Passed emissions test, but why? In-Reply-To: <001501c61ca7$cfc68d50$24f46942@coresys1> Message-ID: <001301c61cf8$99e0ee00$6401a8c0@james0uw35t2hd> Detailed information on closed loop and cold operation can be found at http://sunflower.com/~leroy/P4/section9.htm , if you are interested. It should be in closed loop and out of cold operation at 160. I don't think it really explains why some pass and some fail emissions with a 160 thermostat, though. I have a theory to toss out there. Toss it back if you don't like it. The thermostat sets the minimum cooling system temperature. Maximum cooling temperature is determined more by the radiator, and overall condition of the cooling system. For example, I have a 160 thermostat, but often see temperatures close to 180 (and I think my cooling system is in pretty good shape). Another factor to consider is the intercooler pump. It's not set to come on until around 180, and it's operation would affect the MAT. A failing IC pump may help emissions. Jim _____ From: syty-bounces at syty.org [mailto:syty-bounces at syty.org] On Behalf Of DOlivares Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2006 9:24 PM To: RadarBlueTyphoon at aol.com Cc: syty at syty.org Subject: Re: [Syty] Passed emissions test, but why? Importance: Low It's obviously 'cause, as I plainly said, the ECM algorithms of the SyTys apparently don't correlate IAT & CTS inputs in such a way as to prevent the System from going into closed-loop operation... probably after a fixed amount of TIME or other variable. I "explain" it by the absence of commentary or notices to the contrary. And even though you may have passed emissions-- possibly with a "gentlemen's C"-- with that colder-than-stock unit, I think you might well have ace'd the test with a hotter 'stat! Never having HAD to worry about emissions blues with either my 'Phoon or my 'Clone (which also came with a 160? t-stat but which I changed to a 180? right away as part of the underdrive-pulley installation... to facilitate drivability, increase the lousy mileage, and keep my tootsies warm in that Northern climate), I just never got into the finagling I did with the TTA. Then I leapfrogged to the 10-in-1 a year later and left my SyTy-chip-reprogramming activities on the Bench for a rainy day.... Okay? _____ ----- Original Message ----- From: RadarBlueTyphoon at aol.com To: seravilo at netzero.net Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2006 8:04 PM Subject: Re: [Syty] Passed emissions test, but why? Well Dennis maybe you can explain this one for him. The Ty you purchased from me has run an 160 thermostat since I purchased it and it never failed an emission test her in St. Louis. Tim -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060119/97bee5ef/attachment.html From seravilo at netzero.net Mon Jan 23 09:30:51 2006 From: seravilo at netzero.net (DOlivares) Date: Mon, 23 Jan 2006 09:30:51 -0600 Subject: [Syty] Passed emissions test, but why? References: <001301c61cf8$99e0ee00$6401a8c0@james0uw35t2hd> Message-ID: <001e01c62031$ff1c7820$09f46942@coresys1> I AGREE about the temperature-floor being established by the T-stat, and that is why I was very careful to point out about AMBIENT temp (IAT input) being critical to getting into closed-loop operation... however it impacts the "jetting" and spark-advance curves implemented by the ECM. I fondly remember my 160-equipped TTA jumping in and out of closed-loop during the Winter.... Glad to hear GM solved that problem with SyTys. Being emisso-tested in the peak of Summer-- especially if you can run the A/C hard and then keep it on wile idling in line waiting for the tailpipe probe-- is also advantageous to passing with high scores because the stock radiator cannot dump the heat fast enough to get the water jacket down to the nominal rating-temp of the T-stat. Nowdays-- since my exhaust "scoop" opened up the hood-- I can only get the Syclone to heat above my 180-mark when I'm idling above 95 with the A/C on. This was quite a chore in my TTA which was obviously over-capacity in cooling compared to the Sy.... D.O. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Jim Sloan To: 'DOlivares' ; RadarBlueTyphoon at aol.com Cc: syty at syty.org Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 7:02 AM Subject: RE: [Syty] Passed emissions test, but why? Detailed information on closed loop and cold operation can be found at http://sunflower.com/~leroy/P4/section9.htm , if you are interested. It should be in closed loop and out of cold operation at 160. I don't think it really explains why some pass and some fail emissions with a 160 thermostat, though. I have a theory to toss out there. Toss it back if you don't like it. The thermostat sets the minimum cooling system temperature. Maximum cooling temperature is determined more by the radiator, and overall condition of the cooling system. For example, I have a 160 thermostat, but often see temperatures close to 180 (and I think my cooling system is in pretty good shape). Another factor to consider is the intercooler pump. It's not set to come on until around 180, and it's operation would affect the MAT. A failing IC pump may help emissions. Jim ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ From: syty-bounces at syty.org [mailto:syty-bounces at syty.org] On Behalf Of DOlivares Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2006 9:24 PM To: RadarBlueTyphoon at aol.com Cc: syty at syty.org Subject: Re: [Syty] Passed emissions test, but why? Importance: Low It's obviously 'cause, as I plainly said, the ECM algorithms of the SyTys apparently don't correlate IAT & CTS inputs in such a way as to prevent the System from going into closed-loop operation... probably after a fixed amount of TIME or other variable. I "explain" it by the absence of commentary or notices to the contrary. And even though you may have passed emissions-- possibly with a "gentlemen's C"-- with that colder-than-stock unit, I think you might well have ace'd the test with a hotter 'stat! Never having HAD to worry about emissions blues with either my 'Phoon or my 'Clone (which also came with a 160? t-stat but which I changed to a 180? right away as part of the underdrive-pulley installation... to facilitate drivability, increase the lousy mileage, and keep my tootsies warm in that Northern climate), I just never got into the finagling I did with the TTA. Then I leapfrogged to the 10-in-1 a year later and left my SyTy-chip-reprogramming activities on the Bench for a rainy day.... Okay? ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ----- Original Message ----- From: RadarBlueTyphoon at aol.com To: seravilo at netzero.net Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2006 8:04 PM Subject: Re: [Syty] Passed emissions test, but why? Well Dennis maybe you can explain this one for him. The Ty you purchased from me has run an 160 thermostat since I purchased it and it never failed an emission test her in St. Louis. Tim -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060123/d5d70651/attachment.html From syrjr22 at tds.net Mon Jan 23 14:15:29 2006 From: syrjr22 at tds.net (Sharon Routhier) Date: Mon, 23 Jan 2006 14:15:29 -0600 Subject: [Syty] Ultimate chip Message-ID: <00b501c62059$c28a9cc0$0400a8c0@sharon> Hi. Are these chips still for sale? I'm in the market. Cant seem to get to a web site. Thanks, Ron -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060123/43814d96/attachment.html From loeryder at swbell.net Mon Jan 23 13:21:52 2006 From: loeryder at swbell.net (Jason Granger) Date: Mon, 23 Jan 2006 11:21:52 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Syty] Ultimate chip In-Reply-To: <00b501c62059$c28a9cc0$0400a8c0@sharon> Message-ID: <20060123192152.7461.qmail@web81403.mail.mud.yahoo.com> http://www.sytychips.com/ Or through his resellers at www.raceprovenmotors.com www.detroitturbo.com For full fine tuning ability check out an ECM emulator like Ostrich at www.moates.net Lots of options out there nowadays. Jason Sharon Routhier wrote: Hi. Are these chips still for sale? I'm in the market. Cant seem to get to a web site. Thanks, Ron _______________________________________________ Syty mailing list Syty at syty.org http://lists.syty.org/mailman/listinfo/syty Jas' 92 Typhoon #2407 www.sytyauthority.net -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060123/f550e3f7/attachment.html From L1D2B at aol.com Sun Jan 29 12:22:04 2006 From: L1D2B at aol.com (L1D2B at aol.com) Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 13:22:04 EST Subject: [Syty] Hitch for Tys Message-ID: <23c.5fda755.310e61cc@aol.com> I don't remember who asked this Q, but I finally looked up the hitch that I had put on. It was done by a garage in Corpus Christi, and it was a Drawtite model 36123. He installed it backwards, and I had to slot the plastic bumper cover to put it on - where the slanted ribs of the hitch end flanges stick backwards. It is a small hitch, 3500 # Gross weight w a 300 # tongue Max. I don't remember whether he had to cut the ball slot and turn it around and reweld or not. It doesn't look like it. Lynn D. Brown '87 GN, '89 TTA, '93 Typhoon Denver & SoCal -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060129/e9e6f3d3/attachment.html From L1D2B at aol.com Mon Jan 30 21:33:31 2006 From: L1D2B at aol.com (L1D2B at aol.com) Date: Mon, 30 Jan 2006 22:33:31 EST Subject: [Syty] Bumper Hitch Message-ID: <208.11bb6d3f.3110348b@aol.com> Hey Guys,I just accidently erased todays message on my bumper hitch post. I get so much junk, I end up having to erase 90 % of it. Could U please resend, so I can answer. Lynn D. Brown SoCal and Denver '87 GN, '89 TTA, '93 Typhoon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.syty.org/pipermail/syty/attachments/20060130/dbbcb83d/attachment.html